Isn’t that because the RPF1 was discontinued for pacific territories for the longest time? I’m pretty sure the current listing is a new revision they reintroduced 1-2 years ago. That first diagram is from their new listing where they compare the rigidity of their new RPF1 against previous products. At least that’s what google translate makes it seem like.

 

The middle area is a "standard" wheel and it is used as a basis to compare all of their products against. That image has been on their site for a long time

Here is a similar image from 2016

The current style image was first used in 2019

 

Good find, glad to see this as an option. Not a fan of the wheel weight but it is priced well. Thanks for sharing. I would prefer a lighter forged option, will wait to see if APEX brings any new sizes to market.

 

Respectfully that hasn't been my experience and I haven't seen the same results from the RPF1 as you have with extensive tracking at willow and buttonwillow. I agree on the SA72R though and perhaps if Apex can undercut that wheel in terms of same price, but a little lighter, it would be a great solution but steering limiters and such is not ideal to most S2000 owners, even track guys in some cases, thus going the 17x10 route is precarious and would mean some compromises, I really think the affordable 9 and 9.5 wheel route is the way to go in this day and age. I'm not asking them to make cheap stuff but I am asking to make more alternatives since they already have plenty of forged options. They need to appeal to a larger audience, the who can afford ever increasing forged wheels are dwindling, which is a fact. If they keep going that route, they are going to have to make a decision, less quantity and higher priced products or higher quantity and lower priced products, I feel like they already have the former covered so why not introduce a higher volume alternative to the wedsport lines? Engineering has come a long way as has metallurgy, I firmly believe they can make a SA72R or TC105X competitor at same cost, same strength, yet undercut them in weight slightly. Apex is very talented in what they do and believe their engineers can do it. Your thought process extrapolated over time will only lead to a dying hobby enjoyed by only elites, and a decade or two thereafter track closures. I see it in the 2A community all the time as well. Trijicon and Aimpoint are getting their clocks cleaned by the likes of Holosun with many posts dating back prior to that ascendancy and corresponding market and engineering complacency of similar fashion saying if you can't afford X, you don't belong in the hobby nor if you are asking for an alternative that is even reasonably priced (not budget priced), you don't belong or shouldn't be enjoying that hobby. Those statements historically don't age well and are not welcoming to new generations looking to get into the same hobby. As a reminder, I am asking for TC105X/SA72R alternative with better offsets, I'm not asking for knock off wheels around the $1K/set mark, so I sincerely hope you are not conflating the two.

 

I mean, not trying to trash talk Apex as I think they make a great product and I own their stuff now, but having their wheels in hand and comparing against Rays it does become evident where they cut corners. In your Holosun vs Aimpoint comparison Apex is already the Holosun brand here and Rays is Aimpoint. Apex already is the budget option and is undercutting Rays/Yokohama/BBS/etc... The fit and finish of Apex is still a step below the likes of Rays and I'm perfectly fine with that given the price point and the fact that they are more easily obtainable in unicorn specs. I'll gladly sacrifice a bit of fit and finish bling for their price and quality bracket, and that's not to say that Apex makes an ugly wheel. For me Apex is the better price to quality ratio than Rays. With in this price point I'd still put Apex above T7 in regards to fit and finish but I'm digressing at this point.

Unless I'm reading your comment wrong? You asking for more wheels from their flow formed line?

 

Yes I am asking for a flow formed wheel that fits the S2000 with good BBK clearance and better offset, ie. competitor to TC105X/SA72R

In this scenario, Rays and Volk are trading on their name. Aimpoint and Trijicon are as well but they don't have "JDM status" that assumes magical fairy dust is sprinkled in them that makes them a $1000 more than they should be for any truly valid reason. I have seen many Apex wheels in person and feel their quality is on par with those wheels as well, but perhaps my eyes aren't as keen as yours in seeing quality differences.

Keep in mind this is a survey asking us the consumers what we want which is super respectable and something most other companies don't do. I am an actual customer here with money in hand waiting for a "race silver" wheel from them with better offsets than the TC105X and SA72R at or under $2K/set. Thus I am putting my input here and in the survey, otherwise if it's over $2K, I am actively relaying my feedback that they will not get my money here, so it's all things they have to weigh from this feedback from everyone on this thread and in the survey. As bullwings mentioned, we are in a time of ever increasing costs and many of us will just elect to stay on the wheels we have or RPF1s if there isn't an upgrade path that doesn't jump over two fold for a set. They will never get the Rays and Volk crowd, those people will pay whatever and eat ramen all year if need be as the name means everything to them. If they offer a set of wheels with good brake clearance unlike the RPF1, they will effectively steal much of that market share.

I have to wonder if people here are actually actively shopping for new wheels or just submitting input of what they'd like to "see" on the market but not actually looking to buy what they are advising for or simply what they think others will. I am here to tell Apex that I will buy it if they make what I suggest but if not I will elect to purchase a wedsport or similar instead.

 

I mean I'd still only trust Aimpoint for my duty rifle. Holosun are for the non duty range plinkers, where you just need a half decent sight and it's cost prohibitive to have an Aimpoint on every rifle. Though I can respect Holosun's ingenuity and rapid progress. With their coming duty products we'll see how things change. However I don't think it's exactly the best analogy given how different people's use philosophies are. On fit and finish it's just the law of diminishing returns like any "luxury" item, though I'm not going to go into specifics in their own thread. But suffice to say I like my set of Apex wheels very much and probably will buy more.

 

I agree on your sentiment about duty use vs range use of their early products, but I no longer think that is the case, we are starting to see heavy use in Ukraine and other conflicts of Holosun. On my deployments we used Trijicon and Aimpoint because we weren't buying our own, uncle sam was, we didn't have a choice and consumers don't have the same pockets, I trust them (aimpoint and trijicon) wholeheartedly from my time in the sandbox but my personally owned Holosun of today's breed I trust wholeheartedly as well, they have literally come that far and I think if you watch Erin Cowan's harsh, exhaustive testing it backs this point up. I do however disagree that the analogy is not apt, it certainly is, it's about a small player competing in a big sandbox and innovating and pushing what can be done at a better price point, and if same price point, what can be done with better features. Take it or leave it, Apex here will be making a decision regarding my money specifically here as I'm a consumer ready to purchase today if this comes to fruition. Most importantly however, there are people in your analogy that also value their life and have a choice between affording gear that can do such or simply not at all thus, it's not a "faustian bargain" per say. Many years ago, people used to say all the time, if it's a duty rifle, has to be aimpoint or trijicon, but not anymore, I see many LEO in my area now (family and otherwise) with holosun and they value their lives equally I would assume. Everyone deserves a quality optic at an affordable price without elite or snobbish brands dictating barriers to entry and the same goes for wheels with good brake clearance, offset and price, durability and weight. I personally think Apex can make a SA72R and TC105X competitor that is a little bit better in every metric for the same price.

Of course in this assessment, you are effectively saying Wedsport is not duty rated and shouldn't see any track time? As that is literally the market space I am advocating for from Apex. I will say in many race series in japan, Wedsport runs TC105n for a long time now with great results in time trial and open wheel racing, those are flow formed. Apex already has a high end forged SKU that can service the individuals here that want to run over tanks haha. What are they going to do, release yet another look that is again forged and prohibitively expensive for most? Do they really not already have a look, width and offset suitable for everyone between them and Titan 7 in the forged category?

 

I went on vacation for awhile and came back to a war in the comments!

I'm kidding. I'm kidding. We do appreciate the spirited discussion and feedback about wheel construction though! While we aren't going to pick on any specific wheel model or manufacturer, I can say that our company is motorsports oriented first and foremost. We will always aim to be weight competitive for sure, but we also will not produce a wheel that can't handle track use without failure, even if that means adding more material (which adds weight) for reinforcement.

As for S2000s specifically, this community is in a fairly unique spot. Except for hyper-niche fitments, there isn't exactly a lack of wheel options out there so we have to make sure that whatever we do produce actually makes sense for you. The goal with any future Apex S2000 wheels is to hopefully fulfill a need, more so than just provide another option.

Again, the feedback and the discussion is extremely helpful for that sort of thing, so please continue! We're definitely paying attention.

 

Thank you for chiming in, exactly what I am pointing at, we don't need another option that is well covered, we need a gap FILLED, there is currently a gap that I am speaking of aside from maybe Bullwings advocacy for a 17x10 wheel. But in reality, think about if a good brake clearance, $2K or under wheel exist in 17x9.5 with good offset? The 17x9.5 tc105x has poor brake clearance and poor offset offset compared to it's 17x9 brother model, the 17x9.5 SA72R comes in +47 offset which is not great and is quite heavy, the 17x10 SA72R is also quite heavy even though it is rather cheap. The RPF1 has poor brake clearance and in 9.5" models doesn't have any good offsets. There simply doesn't exist a good brake clearance, good offset affordable wheel for the S2000, and 9.5" is probably the best width for that happy medium and less headaches! What is more amazing is after naming those options, what else is there 17x9.5 made with good offset, good brake clearance, affordable and strong that you can actually find here in the US and are still made? I literally can't think or find any with those metrics in that width besides the SA72R which are quite heavy.

So really what is NEEDED by our community is a 17x9.5 in good offset, good brake clearance, durable, affordable, compete with TC150x pricing and weight but actually has good brake clearance and better offsets than their 17x9.5 (where my money will go to as soon as it's produced to whom makes it first) AND what is NEEDED is a 17x10 forged as well of your existing model line most likely so some guys pushing the absolute limits can avoid going to CCW to have that need filled or deal with SA72R shortcomings. I don't really see any other gaps in the community right now.

I literally have three S2000 owners in my neighborhood that I track with that are all on a RPF1 currently but admit they want something with better offsets and brake clearance but can't afford forged. Should tracking just not be for them then? And before anyones jump to conclusions, one of them worked for Wilwood so they got brake kit at cost, the other two purchased used kits back when times were better and inflation wasn't out of control and my situation was better prior to recent rampant inflation and having a child but I'm certainly looking to replace my RPF1 with something different that can clear my front brake kit but have a max budget of $2K out the door and would sincerely like 9.5" wheels with good offset and love tracking even though I can never keep up with the elites with porsches and seemingly unlimited pockets! My buddies are all on jack stands with their current front brake kits shopping and having the same difficult time as me finding a suitable 9.5" wheel. If only the SA72R had better offsets and less weight I suppose or the TC105x had good brake clearance on that width and better offsets! 17x9.5 SA72R in +47 is not a good offset in my opinion and Apex and Titan 7 has made much better offset fitments for that width in their +51/+57 offerings historically. TC105x is even worse at 17x9.5 +45 with worse brake clearance! RPF1 only makes +45 with poor brake clearance.