Constructive answers to road safety and speeding
04-20-2005, 03:39 AM
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Constructive answers to road safety and speeding
I've partially contributed to the thread here about speeding. What I think is missing from this thread is constructive input on how to make our roads safer. If you want to flame the police, lorry drivers, speed cameras or me do it on that thread.
In this thread please add constructive input on how the safety of our roads can be improved. Things to consider would be: What speed is "safe" in a variety of road and traffic conditions? What other factors come in to play in road safety and how does your solution combat them? How much would it cost to implement such a solution? What are the psychological results on drivers of the solution?
What bothers me is that every single driver on this board (including myself) has at one time or other done something stupid on the road. That stupid behaviour could be as simple as doing 100mph in rush hour traffic, tail-gated the car in front, road-raged at another driver, driven aggressively or just not paid enough attention to what is going on half a mile ahead.
My point is that we're all guilty of lapses of judgement. I don't care whether certain stereotypes of driver suffer these lapses more frequently than others. What can be done to increase road safety by encouraging correct judgement more of the time?
In this thread please add constructive input on how the safety of our roads can be improved. Things to consider would be: What speed is "safe" in a variety of road and traffic conditions? What other factors come in to play in road safety and how does your solution combat them? How much would it cost to implement such a solution? What are the psychological results on drivers of the solution?
What bothers me is that every single driver on this board (including myself) has at one time or other done something stupid on the road. That stupid behaviour could be as simple as doing 100mph in rush hour traffic, tail-gated the car in front, road-raged at another driver, driven aggressively or just not paid enough attention to what is going on half a mile ahead.
My point is that we're all guilty of lapses of judgement. I don't care whether certain stereotypes of driver suffer these lapses more frequently than others. What can be done to increase road safety by encouraging correct judgement more of the time?
04-20-2005, 03:48 AM
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I think the only real way is to have Police Officers who will allow for the conditions re the speed you were doing, usually a verbal warning if enough to scare the sh1t out of most people.
If you have variable speed limits, people ignore these, if you raise the speed limit to 80mph then people will drive at 90mph.
The only thing that is going to make the putting the juristiction back with the Police rather than cameras is the new 'points system' that will make an Officer think I am only just off my target for this month so I will nick some people for doing 10% over the limit rather than giving them a warning.
If it ain't broke don't fix it, just maybe be a bit more leniant !!
If you have variable speed limits, people ignore these, if you raise the speed limit to 80mph then people will drive at 90mph.
The only thing that is going to make the putting the juristiction back with the Police rather than cameras is the new 'points system' that will make an Officer think I am only just off my target for this month so I will nick some people for doing 10% over the limit rather than giving them a warning.
If it ain't broke don't fix it, just maybe be a bit more leniant !!
04-20-2005, 03:51 AM
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Ok Serious suggestion.
Bring back "Public information films". Remember those? with the likes of Peter Pervis? (sp)
There are PLENTY of "drivers" out there that actually don't know the rules of the road.
Keep left at all times; don't use fog lights in the rain but do use dipped headlights; mirror SIGNAL manoeuvre; proper use of roundabouts, "Only a fool breaks the two second rule" etc. etc.
And so on.
Bring back "Public information films". Remember those? with the likes of Peter Pervis? (sp)
There are PLENTY of "drivers" out there that actually don't know the rules of the road.
Keep left at all times; don't use fog lights in the rain but do use dipped headlights; mirror SIGNAL manoeuvre; proper use of roundabouts, "Only a fool breaks the two second rule" etc. etc.
And so on.
04-20-2005, 04:01 AM
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Just realised I haven't addressed exactly what you were asking for.
Speed is only part of the problem and I don't think finding a solution to it will make any difference. My opinion.
As for lapses in judgment. Well being a safe driver has a hell of a lot to do with concentration. I remember hearing some where that the average human can only concentrate on one thing for 20 mins before their mind starts to wonder. I'm not convinced there's anything that can be done with this either.
The best thing to do would be to remove distractions I guess. (Like looking out for speed cameras?
)
One thing that might help is make road signs bigger, easier to read, and more often.
How many times have you been looking for an exit sign, only to miss it because your overtaking 6 trucks at the time you pass it?
Speed is only part of the problem and I don't think finding a solution to it will make any difference. My opinion.
As for lapses in judgment. Well being a safe driver has a hell of a lot to do with concentration. I remember hearing some where that the average human can only concentrate on one thing for 20 mins before their mind starts to wonder. I'm not convinced there's anything that can be done with this either.
The best thing to do would be to remove distractions I guess. (Like looking out for speed cameras?
)One thing that might help is make road signs bigger, easier to read, and more often.
How many times have you been looking for an exit sign, only to miss it because your overtaking 6 trucks at the time you pass it?
04-20-2005, 04:02 AM
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you need to take it as read that there will always be people who want to drive faster than the law allows and that they will make mistakes from time to time. There are lots of factors in any accident but some are easier to influence and change these would include drink and drug driving (which should be glamped down on harder, i've been drink tested several times but never drug tested) speed (less cameras but maybe a few more cops as ling as they didn't spil my back road fun), road conditions (something that we can control and which can be an easy fix if there is money spent on improving dangerous junctions, widening some roads, high grip surfaces, better use of double white lines, more sharp bend and warning signs etc.) and driver training (advanced cources, longer driving test with night driving, teaching motorway lane dicipine etc.) Road safty would also be improved by getting all the old bangers off the road and clamping down on those without insurance and tax paid who would tend to be the ones who wouldn't take care of their cars.
04-20-2005, 04:06 AM
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Education, Education, Education.
Every driver makes a value judgement about what they consider is a safe way to proceed. They make that judgement based on environmental facors and the likely outcomes of their actions - the more infomed a driver is, the better they will drive. This is the crux of the absolute/appropriate speed argument - if drivers were all to drive at an appropriate speed for the conditions, there would be less accidents, but to do so required education and an awareness of the possible outcomes.
Information provided by the media, by roadside police officers stopping drivers and teaching them about the dangers they pose to other motorists, in schools (we had a member of the IAM come into school when I was 17 and talk to us about driving, it changed my attitude almost overnight).
Of course this doesn't take into account those who won't be told, or are determined to do what they want, but most accidents are just that, accidental and simply slowing people down does not affect the root cause of this.
It seems to be conveniently left out of most of the information on cameras etc. I see that we have the safest roads in Europe per head of population. Also that, until last year, when the trend worryingly reversed, the numbers of people killed on the roads fell yearly. We should build on what has been succesful in the past, education and car safety measures.
Every driver makes a value judgement about what they consider is a safe way to proceed. They make that judgement based on environmental facors and the likely outcomes of their actions - the more infomed a driver is, the better they will drive. This is the crux of the absolute/appropriate speed argument - if drivers were all to drive at an appropriate speed for the conditions, there would be less accidents, but to do so required education and an awareness of the possible outcomes.
Information provided by the media, by roadside police officers stopping drivers and teaching them about the dangers they pose to other motorists, in schools (we had a member of the IAM come into school when I was 17 and talk to us about driving, it changed my attitude almost overnight).
Of course this doesn't take into account those who won't be told, or are determined to do what they want, but most accidents are just that, accidental and simply slowing people down does not affect the root cause of this.
It seems to be conveniently left out of most of the information on cameras etc. I see that we have the safest roads in Europe per head of population. Also that, until last year, when the trend worryingly reversed, the numbers of people killed on the roads fell yearly. We should build on what has been succesful in the past, education and car safety measures.
04-20-2005, 04:10 AM
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Have come to the conclusion that crap driving is quite often due to drivers looking no further ahead than their bonnet.
Seen too much bad examples of how to control a car over the past couple of days and it seems to me its always due to people not looking and planning far enough ahead.
My 2p.
Seen too much bad examples of how to control a car over the past couple of days and it seems to me its always due to people not looking and planning far enough ahead.
My 2p.
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04-20-2005, 04:10 AM
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My 10p....
I think one of the biggest problems we (drivers & riders) have to face is the media demonisation of 'petrolheads'. It drives me insane when the constant flippant remarks always blame speed or recklessness for incidents - when driver error or misjudgment is such a big factor.
This constant drip feed of media sensationalisim eats into the brains of 'joe public' & they use anecdotal catch phrases to explain road incidents - when actually they do not understand the real issues.
I don't have an answer - but educating drivers from an early age into cause & effect & breeding a responsibility for ones actions may help - certainly I've drilled it into the murgatriod (my 16yr old) some of the issues & hope he's better equipped. The 'Think' TV & Cinema ads addressing the mobile phone / ipod generation & certainly some of their messages get through.... they've pitched it spot on - it just frustrates me that the focus messages from the government for adults is based on speed, when it should be on ALL the common driving errors (Conditions, tailgaiting, tiredness, in-car entertainment etc).
I think one of the biggest problems we (drivers & riders) have to face is the media demonisation of 'petrolheads'. It drives me insane when the constant flippant remarks always blame speed or recklessness for incidents - when driver error or misjudgment is such a big factor.
This constant drip feed of media sensationalisim eats into the brains of 'joe public' & they use anecdotal catch phrases to explain road incidents - when actually they do not understand the real issues.
I don't have an answer - but educating drivers from an early age into cause & effect & breeding a responsibility for ones actions may help - certainly I've drilled it into the murgatriod (my 16yr old) some of the issues & hope he's better equipped. The 'Think' TV & Cinema ads addressing the mobile phone / ipod generation & certainly some of their messages get through.... they've pitched it spot on - it just frustrates me that the focus messages from the government for adults is based on speed, when it should be on ALL the common driving errors (Conditions, tailgaiting, tiredness, in-car entertainment etc).
04-20-2005, 04:27 AM
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same as been said above - but teaching people to pass a driving test is not the same as learning to drive. Its easy to drive/ride fast in a straight line, but observing and using those observations of the road is another - we had this discussion at the weekend, and typically car drivers rarely look beyond the car in front, let alone at the sides of the road or far further forward. Rear observation also alarmingly lacks too.
04-20-2005, 04:36 AM
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Originally Posted by MarkB,Apr 20 2005, 01:06 PM
Education, Education, Education.
Every driver makes a value judgement about what they consider is a safe way to proceed. They make that judgement based on environmental facors and the likely outcomes of their actions - the more infomed a driver is, the better they will drive. This is the crux of the absolute/appropriate speed argument - if drivers were all to drive at an appropriate speed for the conditions, there would be less accidents, but to do so required education and an awareness of the possible outcomes.
Information provided by the media, by roadside police officers stopping drivers and teaching them about the dangers they pose to other motorists, in schools (we had a member of the IAM come into school when I was 17 and talk to us about driving, it changed my attitude almost overnight).
Of course this doesn't take into account those who won't be told, or are determined to do what they want, but most accidents are just that, accidental and simply slowing people down does not affect the root cause of this.
It seems to be conveniently left out of most of the information on cameras etc. I see that we have the safest roads in Europe per head of population. Also that, until last year, when the trend worryingly reversed, the numbers of people killed on the roads fell yearly. We should build on what has been succesful in the past, education and car safety measures.
Every driver makes a value judgement about what they consider is a safe way to proceed. They make that judgement based on environmental facors and the likely outcomes of their actions - the more infomed a driver is, the better they will drive. This is the crux of the absolute/appropriate speed argument - if drivers were all to drive at an appropriate speed for the conditions, there would be less accidents, but to do so required education and an awareness of the possible outcomes.
Information provided by the media, by roadside police officers stopping drivers and teaching them about the dangers they pose to other motorists, in schools (we had a member of the IAM come into school when I was 17 and talk to us about driving, it changed my attitude almost overnight).
Of course this doesn't take into account those who won't be told, or are determined to do what they want, but most accidents are just that, accidental and simply slowing people down does not affect the root cause of this.
It seems to be conveniently left out of most of the information on cameras etc. I see that we have the safest roads in Europe per head of population. Also that, until last year, when the trend worryingly reversed, the numbers of people killed on the roads fell yearly. We should build on what has been succesful in the past, education and car safety measures.
I would like to see the driving test made more difficult. It should at the very least include motorway driving.
You should be made to do an "advanced" driving course within say 3 years of passing your test. You should be made to redo this test until you pass (in the meantime you should still be allowed to drive) with a maximum of 5 attempts. The advanced test having to be passed withing 3 years say.
Better thought out road design should be introduced-possibly a taskforce set up to look into britains worst roads and then to come up with solutions. The taskforce should be set up with "experts" from the driving world.
I have plenty of other idea but haven't the time to write them down