BledS2k

Hi all,

I've recently bought a stereo off a fellow member complete with all the required leads etc & I'd appreciate some help before I fit it choosing some new kit & any tips regarding installation.

I am going to replace the door speakers with again components (MY02) & so far I've been looking at the Focal 165A1 components as they seem to be quite popular on here.

I also thought that whilst everything is apart it might be a good idea to fit some rear speakers behind the seats & plus/either or some speakers in the roll hoops.

Ok so here's where the questions begin:

Door Speakers - Are Focal 165 A1's any good? or within reason are there much better speakers out there?

The Focal's come with a separate crossovers - would I need to use/package this in the door somewhere or can I use current
wiring?

Would it be worthwhile putting some sound deadening on the doors whilst I've got everything apart? (Unfortunately on a budget)


Rear Speakers - I've been thinking to improve the overall sound & going from the comments on the forum from my research, speakers behind the seat are great for giving that extra bass punch, but roll hoop speakers are also great for clarity & roof down volumes. With this in mind & the fact I already have some spare pre-cut panels behind the seats, I thought I'd look into again fitting some components with x2 6.5"'s behind the seats & then making my own speaker pods to house the tweeters in my roll hoops.

My only thought is I have no idea how well this would work? How to wire it? & generally I'd appreciate some comments to give me the fuzzy feeling before I spend my hard earned bucks


Thanks in advance & I appreciate any comments or help.

Brent

lovegroova

Firstly, have a look at the electronics forum - lots of great info there: https://www.s2ki.com/s2000/forum/26-s2000-electronics/

My view, which not everyone agrees with, is that you'd be far better off spending money on better door speakers/an and amp rather than splitting your budget by adding rear speakers which will destroy any stereo imaging that you might have (i.e. you only hear the right channel when driving along).

The only speaker worth putting behind you is a subwoofer - firing components at the seat back is just silly, unless you're very short and have the seat a long way forward.

See my signature for what I have - it sounds utterly superb with great imaging.

Door speakers:
You can fit the crossover boxes into the doors easily enough. As above, go for something a bit further up the Focal range, say the K2 Power 165KR or the P165V15. You'll need an amplifier to get the best out of these - loads of great value ones on Ebay - you can't go wrong with the Alpine stuff but there's plenty of bargains to be had. Get a 4-channel amp, so you can add a subwoofer as well.

Rear Speakers, as above, save you money and spend it on a subwoofer instead. That is your path to proper low frequency performance.

Rilot

What Lovegroova said.
I went with an Audison SRx amp, Focal 165A1 comps and a JL 10W0 sub.
I'm going to swap the Focals for either the K2s or the Hertz 165USKs as the 165A1s I'm finding very harsh at high volumes. Especially with high frequencies.

Also, save £50 for Dynamat. You wouldn't believe the diffence properly deadened doors makes to the quality of midbass.

GaryB

I have an Alpine IDA-X100, 4 channel amp and Alpine SPG-17CS speakers in both the doors and the roll hoops. Along with liberal sound deadening in the doors it's utterly brilliant!

I had just the fronts with a boot sub box for a while but prefer this set up now. I got my boot space back and there's enough bass for my needs.

BledS2k

Thanks for the comments all

A bit more info I guess would probably be useful.

Stereo: Alpine ida-x311rr

Music: Everything from Pink Floyd right through the spectrum to bass heavy electronic music - pretty much the only type that won't be played is opera (no offence).

Volume / desired outcome: I'm certainly only interested in pleasing my ears & perhaps a passenger, certainly no-one on the side of the road.
I find at the moment that the sound isn't balanced with just the front speakers, the quality is pap (it is standard stuff) & I would like to be able to enjoy all my types of music at a volume that I can't hear myself singing to or from the road what speed I'm travelling at

lovegroova - Cheers for the link, I'll definitely check that out.

Appreciate your comments, but so I could understand a bit further could you explain what you mean by Imaging?

Another reason I though about adding the split between the components in rear (6.5" behind the seat & tweeter in hoops) was to I guess compensate for not having a sub & to try to balance out the sound around the car. Where do you fit subs & does the noise really travel that far if its in the boot?

Door Speakers - So I would need to use the crossovers & cant just use the existing cabling within the door, ok. As for speaker choice there only seems to be one retailer selling the P165V15 so I assume this is an old model? Also what Alpine speakers would you recommend?



Rilot - Ok I'll take a look into those speakers, thanks. £50 for Dynamat - Is that the only brand or are there just as good more unknown options?


GaryB - Did you say you had them in the hoops as well? Both the 6.5" & the tweeter? & if you don't mind me asking how come you went from the sub to this option & what kind of music do you listen to? (I tend to use all my boot space quite often & could do without sacrificing it to a sub).



Again thanks for the comments all - keep them coming & the more the merrier

lovegroova

Imaging - the whole point of stereo is that you get an "image" of where the music is coming from. For example the singer should generally appear to be standing directly in front of you. Of course, with stereo speakers, the singer's sound is actually coming from left and right speakers in equal amounts, thus giving the image that they are in the "middle" of the image.
If you listen to your Pink Floyd, you'll hear that the drum sounds appear to come from different places in the image - the "hi-hat" and "ride" cymbals will probably be on opposite sides, reflecting their placement in real life.
More extreme examples are some of the early stereo Beatles recordings, where various instruments only come out of one speaker.

This imaging obviously works best in a home environment, but you at least want the sound of what you're listening to come from in front of you. Having a headrest speaker means that you'll be hearing the sound from the right channel a lot more than you will the left, so things will sound weird. Your passenger will have the opposite experience.

See here for some photos of my setup https://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/473...#entry16429072 you can see the sub takes up very little room and can be removed in under a minute if necessary.

The sub box comes from here: http://www.darksidesubs.com/ the owner is a member on here too. (Mines a V1 passenger side)

You can use the existing speaker wire, which you connect to the input of each crossover, and then you'll need short runs from the crossover to the woofer and the tweeter.
The Alpine SPR17S are pretty good and the SPX17REFs will be very good indeed if my old versions are anything to go by. However, you need to be a bit careful with speakers. In general, the more you spend, the more you need an amp to drive them.

To start with, I'd recommend getting a 4 channel amp and some decent door speakers. You can run the amp in 2 channel mode for lots of power with which you can driver them properly.

If you wanted to add a subwoofer, you can then use the amp in 2+1 mode which will reduce the power to the door speakers but this will be more than compensated by having the load taken on by the subwoofer.

A sub is great because producing low frequencies is what uses up amplifier power (you need to move more air). By freeing-up your door speakers from producing these frequencies, they and the amp require a lot less power to work just as well.

If that still wasn't enough, you could use the head unit's internal amplifier to power some headrest speakers.

One of these will be enough sound deadening: http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/sile...lume-pack.html

GaryB

I have open headrests MY00 so I'm not firing sound at the seat back. Yes, I have mids and tweeters in the roll hoops and can adjust balance and fade do I can get the sound I want. I changed from coax rears to component rears about 6 months ago. I skimped on rear speakers initially for the reasons above and they were only providing "fill" sound but changing to quality components has made a big difference.

I listen to everything from rock to soul/funk but am not a big bass monster. I don't want window rattling club tracks. Although I can "feel" the bass in "Another one bites the dust" when it comes on at high volumes.

At a steady 90mph with the top down and the music cranked up, me and the missus can sing at full volume and not hear ourselves over the music (thankfully).

I can "take it to 11" with no bass distortion on any of my music. I would like to experiment with a sub in addition to what I have now but I only have a 4 channel amp and am not willing to sacrifice boot space so that'll have to wait.

GaryB

To add, I started out following LG's advice, he certainly knows his onions. The only thing we seem to differ in opinion on is re the rear speakers. For the type of music I like, I believe I have what I want and have control of imaging through adjustment of fade and balance but I haven't heard his setup again.

As he suggests above though, I may use my HU's internal amp to power my rears and throw my sub box back in the boot powered by the amp as an experiment to see if it's worth trying to mount a rear sub (possibly in the spare wheel space). Once again he's given me something to think about when I thought I was happy with what I had lol.

lovegroova

The "firing at the seat back" comment was referring to the "Rear Speakers" paragraph in the OP.

The main point here is really to concentrate on getting the door speakers setup really good before adding "rear speakers" of any sort.

I think that gives the best overall value for money in the long run.

Gary,
I do enjoy spending other people's money!!!

GaryB

Agreed. Following your advice and getting an amp powering components and sound deadening made a massive initial difference. From there on it was about getting it to suit my tastes.