S2000RJ

T1mbo, I agree with you and AnDy_PaNdY that the forum is excellent for sharing information about the S2000. I too have learnt a great deal from other owner's experiences.

My concern is that although around 100 uk owners along with a few thousand in other markets, with little in common apart from a love of the S2000, can help each other by sharing experiences, it is something that Honda UK seems unable to achieve. I can understand that Honda does not want to recall every car for a new clutch, but I would at least expect that each dealer should be told by Honda what issues there are with the car. The troubleshooting routines in the shop manual are very theoretical. Unless there are updates on the CD version, it does not cover real world experiences. I would expect Honda to develop additional troubleshooting steps to identify known problems. The danger is that owners from this board will go to their dealer and say that item x is faulty. If the dealer does not have the experience, they may agree and replace item x. It keeps the owner happy and Honda UK is paying anyway. What happens if this still does not fix the problem. I am aware that the hesitation / kangerooing may be cause by faulty connections, bad oxygen sensors, MAP sensor or IAT sensor. Which do you change? I believe that the MAPsensor is around 250 pounds. This work is not cheap, so Honda ultimately is going to suffer if the diagnosis is not right. I am also concerned for the poor, overwealming majority who are not readers of this board. What are their exeriences, or do they just get the stock answer of "they all do that"?

I realize that Matt is a salesman. I did look at their website, however I did not know at the time that he would shortly be joining us as a driver / owner. Welcome on board Matt. This puts Matt in a difficult situation, as the cynics amongst us will think he's after buisiness even if that's not his intention. I just wish that Honda would keep their salesmen better informed about the car.

S2000RJ

I appear to have received the stock Honda reaction to my previous correspondance. Southern Counties rang me to say the parts are in. What part of I do not want them to perform any more work on the car, until they have sorted their Q.A., is not understood?

I sent a letter to Honda at the beginning of the week, listing all 45 current faults on my car, some of which have not been rectified since delivery two years ago Twenty of these fault are a direct result of poor workmanship by dealers, including ten cases of actual physical damage by them.

Ianl, I have included the poor finish of the replacement wheels and the mysterious, misty rear light clusters in this list

I have asked Honda to take responsibility of the car themselves, I do not expect it to be returned until all faults are resolved. I've asked for an equivalent replacement car during the time mine is off the road, but also suggested that it would be better for all concerned if Honda were to replace the faulty vehicle. I have sent a copy of the letter to my finance company. I arranged my finance through one of the major motoring organisations, so it will be interesting to see their reaction.

Roll on the Watchdog Supermeet

ianl

Well, I think you are going about this the right way Rob, and I really hope that Honda 'play the white man', although I must say with my (by comparison) trivial dealing with them re. sorting out the replacement wheels, I will not be holding my breath.

Look forward to seeing you in Shrewsbury Rob (are you joining the 'Southern Convoy'?)

tonyh

On the car rejection topic, eventually received reply form Honda Finance. After investigation with the dealer , the dealer stated that my car was still under warranty so Honda Finance suggest I take it to said dealer for repair, clutch only, no mention of respray.
Replied to them by return of post stating that I will not be making another payment until this situation is resolved to my satisfaction.
That got a response within the week, still same old tune though, but no mention of action if payments not made. Their letter clearly underlines Honda UKs problem with this car, they just wish it would go away. It is obvious from the response that no investigation took place at all, because if they had they would have realised that I had already rejected car to Dealer who promtly threw it over the wall to Honda Uk as a product issue, so if the dealer beleives this to be a faulty product why don't they just replace the car, it would not cost them a penny, the warranty claims must be costing them more. They 'cannot buy my car back because they say the faults are not manufacturing issues'. So three clutches/ gearboxes and one respray (now needing another) are not manufacturing faults. Fancy my chances in front of a court I do. Lets get ready to rumble. Sale of goods act 1979 (amended) and all that.

tonyh.

gdowsett-uk

My rejection letter goes off to my finance company tommorrow, thankfully not Honda Finance, with my 24 page service report ! I'll keep you all posted .

S2000RJ

What fun .... spent this afternoon making a few phone calls to see where I stand.

Honda are arranging for their S2000 specialist to inspect the car. This will be carried out at the dealer, but I have insisted that I want to be present throughout.

My finance company basically doesn't give a fvck, but reminded me that I have an obligation to continue making payments.

I then spoke to the AA, as we have legal assistance through Honda Care. The guy there confirmed that my claim would be with the finance company. Line went very quiet when I commented that it was interesting, as AA Finance Services did not want to know. So that's a big :thumbdown: to the AA. Maybe I should become a RAC member

I can't get through to Tesco Insurance to find out what legal advice they can provide.

I think my next step is to arrange my own vehicle inspection, as recommended by the AA, before they realized their conflict of interest. The people to contact are the Institure of Automotive Engineers tel 01543 251346. Unfortunately they have very short afternoons , so I shall try again tomorrow.

I have also been doing a bit of digging on the web, especially the Watchdog site. Has anyone tried the Society of Motor Manufacturers & Traders Ltd? They are the body who deal with disputes involving new car warranties. It seems there is an arbitration process
Code of Practice for the Motor Industry - Complaints & Arbitration. I am tempted to go down this route, as I feel that the incompetence of Honda's agents should be bought to the attention of an industry watchdog. I have experienced first hand with two authorised dealers some very dangerous and negligent practices. I feel that dealing with Honda directly, the problems are just swept under the carpet.

I'll see how I go with Honda, etc. but I'm more inclined to go to BBC Watchdog, as I believe this is a matter of public interest, rather than getting stuck in a drawn out legal proces.

gdowsett-uk

Well the finance company aren't as yet playing ball, surprise, surprise but I'm persisting. How about a picket outside Honda, with Watchdog in attendance ?

S2000RJ

Could be done, only it's a bit far to drive with my car in it's current condition.

I don't want to do anything with my car, until I have seen the two inspection reports, then I will be hassling any one I can.

Maybe we could have a meet in London on 8/9th June http://www.hondaintheuk.co.uk/news/pr/02_0..._grandprix.html

Or Honda usually put in an appearance at Goodwood on 12/13/14 June.

gaddafi

"Rejecting" a car becomes progressively more difficult the longer you keep it and as soon as you allow someone to try and repair it. There are recent test cases which have not been helpful to the consumer. In practice, it seems the best time to reject goods is when you take delivery. Of course, most people are so thrilled they may overlook something (I did) or feel it is OK for the dealer to fix it. I doubt that you have a snowball's chance of rejecting a vehicle a year or so after taking delivery. Goodwill replacement is a different matter but I wouldn't hold my breath........

Dealer talk about fixing things under warranty can be a smokescreen. You are protected under the sale of goods act and if you bought the car with finance my understanding is that the dealer and the finance company are both liable for quality under this act. If you buy a washing machine and it is faulty it is down to the retailer to fix it and not the manufacturer. They can try to pass the buck this way but it is not legal.

I would advise anyone with a grievance to talk to their local trading standards office. Advice is free and even if they can't take action directly, you will get quality information and will know where you stand and what options you have in law.

Anyone looking for paint/body repairs - talk to Chandlers BMW in Angmering West Sussex. Talk to Martin. No, not cheap but as good as it gets. They reshelled an E36 M3 for me and it was better than new.

S2000RJ

Hi Gaddafi, thanks for your input. I may be in the minority here, but I consider that to reject the car is a last resort. I am more interested in having it repaired to the standard that it left the factory. If it were to be replaced, I would prefer a MY00/01 to the MY02, so I'm not even trying to get a cheap upgrade. My main concern is the negligence of the two dealers that I have taken the car to. What is frustrating is the sheer incompetence of the dealers and the geriatric pace of Honda (UK) to act. In my experience it took them 4 weeks to refer me back to the dealer. It seems that they are slowly waking up, but I want to ensure that I document everything in case they do not offer an acceptable solution.

How are you getting on with your problems? Did you read about my experiences in Ferring? What really infuriates me is that I currently do not have a serviceable car, so will miss driving at the SuperMeet.