chris2002

The amount of polishing products out there is really mindboggling. Is it possible to use too aggressive a product and wear off the clear coat? It seems awfully hard to pick the right product when each manufacturer uses different names for their products and the language regarding the level of abrasives in each product varies and is deliberately vague on the product the label, if it mentions it at all.

Is there some standard somewhere? Or has anyone put togther a chart listing each manufacturer and their product line with increasing or decreasing levels of abrasiveness. Wax=Polish=Glaze=Rubbing Compound?

The only commonality I can see on some is (clear coat safe), but that does not describe one application or many.

Over the years, I have seen instances of great looking cars, that aged very quickly because the clearcoat was polished off.

It also seems that present Honda paint is quite delicate and thin. This is compared to having owned older Hondas, and one Porsche (best paint).

BB_S2K

I think this is what you are looking for? Not definitive, but I found it informational.

http://www.properautocare.com/copoglcoch.html

wanabe

chris- the chart above is excellent...

my answer to your question is that it is theoretically possible to use a compound to remove your clear coat. however, first, you very rarely need a compound- and next you would have to use it many times.

with normal swirl removal, you will not be removing much of your clearcoat. most swirl removers actually just remove the edges of swirls (they take off the edge of the micro scratch) so that the light does not reflect off of the edge and we cant see them any more. many swirl removers also contain some filler to fill in the bottom of the swirls.

finally, if you are using an orbital machine, you will be even less aggressive at taking off the clear.

conclusion:

dont worry about it!

i have seen very few cars with clear damage from polishing. it is much more common to see clear damage from lack of care. on cars that dont get washed and waxed or some sorta protection you do see damage eventually (either clear peeling or clear bubbling then peeling). on cars that are protected, even with lotsa polishing it is rare to see clear damage (again, with a random orbital)

animeS2K

^^ what he said.

With a rotary, perhaps there's something to worry about. With the PC? There's a fellow on Autopia that has and uses a paint thickness gauge and the most he's registered with aggressive PC-based polishing on a relatively thin spot was 2-3 microns...

http://autopia.org/forum/showpost.ph...5&postcount=12

chris2002

Thank you for the info. Although I have done numerous searches. It did not come clear(coat) to me until your notes. My thanks to you wanabe and animeS2k.

That chart is excellent thanks. I would love one that has all of the popular wax/polish formulations, perhaps one can be put together with enough input and we can have a brand to brand comparison...

chris2002

The other info is quite eye-opening. I have not been using a PC and until recently did not understand the difference between a PC and a Power Buffer. I viewed it simply as a very expensive toy.

Most of my experience comes from using my hands to apply and an inexpensive orbital (Pep Boys) to remove and shine. I am thinking that I will invest in a PC in the near future.

The car I saw with the thin clear coat was a 1998 911, and the owner DID USE a power buffer. Now that I understand the difference, it explains a lot. Car looked great for a little while, then like crap...

Most of the guys in the Porsche Club of Northern NJ Chapter are shown to use their hands to wax, not machines, Concours Techniques etc. That's how I learned.

But I don't have the luxury of a garage, besides which, my S2000 is a daily driver commuting from NJ to NYC. So I try to keep it clean and try to regularly put on an easy protective coat.

Meguiars Gold Class is what I used for my 924S, and it give the S2000 a nice "goldish" shine. I have shifted to NXT, which it gives a crisper shine. I can see the pearl metallic flakes a little better and it is easy to use.

However, but both products do not seem to last more than a few weeks. No more than two or three washings, even when using something as gentle as Sonax.

I have tried to layer, first NXT then Gold Class on top. This is my first experiment. Seems to work well especially when cleaning off bird poop. I realize that both waxes may have some cleaners so the layers are probably not very thick. But the surface does seem slick and does not seem to attract too much dust. Did I mention it is easier to remove bird poop.

Some of those silcone oils (Blue Coral Touchless and now, Turtlewax Ice) seem to be dust magnets, is it the formulation? or is it the chemistry?


Thanks for the insights. A little goes a long way.

MikeyC

Here is another polish chart with a couple of more brands on it. This chart also contains Meguiar's so you can use that column as a "key" to compare across the two charts.

another polish chart

Megs Gold Class and Megs NXT are not known for their durability. If you really like Meguiar's products you may want to switch to Megs #21 Polymer Sealant and/or Meguiar's #26 wax. Alternatively, you could begin experimenting with other brands. If you can tell me what your goals are in terms of durability, shine, amount of time you're willing to spend then I can point in you some more specific directions.

chris2002

Thank you Mikey. That chart is great. Can you tell me the difference between Meguair's Consumer and Professional formulations? There is a lot of BS out there. This is an instance where reading the labels really tells you nothing and there is no ingredient list to check.

What I can decern is that the professionals don't come with cleaners or silicons are they on any way longer lasting?

chris2002

For me, I would love to use some of the great waxes/polishes out there but I don't think it would make difference. But I am open to suggestions.

A car parked outside 24/7 and used to commute to NYC in winter, spring, summer and fall, leads a very hard life. That's why I try to wash it at least once a week and wax it once every two weeks weather permitting.

My car looks great for all of the use it has. No oxidation, very little machine swirls, but lots of minute swirls from road grit and sand. Lower body side moldings show that the car is rarely parked from the minute sandblasting. Don't forget this S2000 is driven in ice, snow, rain. Mixed emotions....

It's why I tried the Mr. Clean system and why I switched to NXT. I am not particularly wedded to Meguiars. I have found their products readily available at the local auto parts store and to be a step above NuFinish, Simonize, Turtle Wax, etc.

That's why I think that the commerical Meguiars Gold Class and NXT work for me.

If I had a garage and only used the car on weekends on nice days. Things might be different. I might get a Porter Cable and a slew of polishes, glazes and waxes.

Part of the heavy use of the car is that I get the inevitable stone and rock chips which mark the nose , and pit the windshield , bird poop on the roof and parking lot dents from inconsiderate people.

It seems sort of counter productive to put on a showcar mirror shine around those surface defects on a bright yellow car. On a gray or black car it may escape notice more. My 924S was gunmetal grey and it hid ALOT by comparison.

This is a great site and the advice and information is first rate. Thanks.

MikeyC

I feel your pain. My car is essentially a daily driver that only sees light use during the winter. It's not garaged either (except during winter). My car without a doubt has rock chips and dings (jerks!), but I still like to treat it like a garage queen.
FYI, black cars show scratches, dents, and dirt much worse than a yellow car. In fact, black is the hardest color to keep looking new because it shows EVERYTHING.

Anyway, it's really hard to describe the differences between the Megs consumer line (Deep Crystal series?) and the Mirror Glaze line (tan bottles). From a really high level the differeneces are the LSPs are much more durable in the MG line, there are way more polishes in the MG line, and I believe all the consumer polishes are chemical polishes (as opposed to abrasive polishes). Plus the consumer stuff is designed to be applied by hand and most of the MG products are designed for machine use.

IMO, I think you would be happier with a product that had a little more cleaning power, did not involve many more steps, and lasts longer. So, I would suggest to you to try the Klasse twins or to try the Jeff's Acrylic series kit. Both are similar products, but the Jeff's products are a newer formula and are gaining wide popularity.

If you buy either, it will add one extra step to your process. Both products are basically two step products. The first step is a cleaner/basecoat. This will remove oxidation and old wax then put down a basecoat of protection. The second step puts on a more serious layer of protection. You don't need both steps all the time. So, it won't always add more work. However, the car will shine better and the protection will last significantly longer.