xviper has left the building
10-06-2006, 03:16 AM
#81
Not sure what thread this quote was in, but it is an indication of cthree's (Erik's) opinion on the subject:
QUOTE (cthree @ Oct 5 2006, 03:23 PM)
Oh the drama. I'm fed up with Dave having a melt down biannually. After 5.5 years and 38000 posts you would think you would learn to get along and not take things personally. If nate does things for people and doesn't want them copied then that's his right and it's not xviper's right to challenge that.
I think nate is fighting a losing battle. I think nate's s2000 illustrations violate Honda's trademark. Neither of those things are any of my business and I'm not going to get bent about it but Dave seems to think it's his and he seems to think it's worth going to the mat over. Whatever.
It is true that Dave would get fed up every now and then. But I, for one, was always glad he reconsidered. I'd like him to this time, also, but it doesn't look promising. Unfortunately, Erik sometimes doesn't have a way with words, either.
QUOTE (cthree @ Oct 5 2006, 03:23 PM)
Oh the drama. I'm fed up with Dave having a melt down biannually. After 5.5 years and 38000 posts you would think you would learn to get along and not take things personally. If nate does things for people and doesn't want them copied then that's his right and it's not xviper's right to challenge that.
I think nate is fighting a losing battle. I think nate's s2000 illustrations violate Honda's trademark. Neither of those things are any of my business and I'm not going to get bent about it but Dave seems to think it's his and he seems to think it's worth going to the mat over. Whatever.
It is true that Dave would get fed up every now and then. But I, for one, was always glad he reconsidered. I'd like him to this time, also, but it doesn't look promising. Unfortunately, Erik sometimes doesn't have a way with words, either.
10-06-2006, 03:41 AM
#82
I don't know. I think if I owned a board like S2KI and someone like Dave was participating, I'd go out of my way to try to keep him happy. Not at the sake of other members, but I'd do everything I could. I think this requres more than a shrug.
If Erik could just take the lead and ask everyone to step back and take a breather I think everyone would realize how silly this whole thing is. Certainly not worth losing xviper or angering others over.
If Erik could just take the lead and ask everyone to step back and take a breather I think everyone would realize how silly this whole thing is. Certainly not worth losing xviper or angering others over.
10-06-2006, 04:03 AM
#83
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^^Bezactly.
To the extent that this particular forum (Vintage) is a little, sheltered world, its linkage to the rest of S2KI serves only two real purposes that I can see: a recruitment tool for Vintage and a technical resource for Vintage members.
(Well, maybe a third as well: there's also the voyeur factor, where we can step back into that other world to watch in fascination the bizarre stuff going on.)
With the departure of a significant part of the technical resource, the linkage becomes all the more tenuous. What, we can ask, do we need S2KI for? Is the recruiting a sufficient hook to remain a part of this site?
I'm not suggesting severing ties, mind you; I'm suggesting the site's owner should be asking such questions instead of shrugging this off. HPH
To the extent that this particular forum (Vintage) is a little, sheltered world, its linkage to the rest of S2KI serves only two real purposes that I can see: a recruitment tool for Vintage and a technical resource for Vintage members.
(Well, maybe a third as well: there's also the voyeur factor, where we can step back into that other world to watch in fascination the bizarre stuff going on.)
With the departure of a significant part of the technical resource, the linkage becomes all the more tenuous. What, we can ask, do we need S2KI for? Is the recruiting a sufficient hook to remain a part of this site?
I'm not suggesting severing ties, mind you; I'm suggesting the site's owner should be asking such questions instead of shrugging this off. HPH
10-06-2006, 05:02 AM
#84
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I will miss Xv. I read every thread by him and used many of his "How tos". He has never steered anybody wrong and always tried to help. That alone deserves respect by all. Too bad it takes so long to realize this for some.
Unfortunately in any electronic form of communication people often say things they wouldn't say to someone's face. People need to think twice before they hit the send/reply key.
It seems the older I get, the more mellow I get. I used to know everything too! Then I realized I didn't and learned to listen, observe and then learn through that. Unfortuately we will have to feel the same pain most of our parents did with a yonger generation. We need to show some patience. The yonger generation need to learn how to listen, observe and then learn. We may never get it right, but we should try!
Unfortunately in any electronic form of communication people often say things they wouldn't say to someone's face. People need to think twice before they hit the send/reply key.
It seems the older I get, the more mellow I get. I used to know everything too! Then I realized I didn't and learned to listen, observe and then learn through that. Unfortuately we will have to feel the same pain most of our parents did with a yonger generation. We need to show some patience. The yonger generation need to learn how to listen, observe and then learn. We may never get it right, but we should try!
10-06-2006, 05:29 AM
#85
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If they would fix the %#$^&$% search engine on this site maybe Dave wouldn't have reached the point where that little thing pushed him over the edge. 
Dave it was always good reading your posts and you lasted way longer than I thought you would. 
By the way Dave is alive and well elsewhere on the web.
I saw an application for Forum Jackass yesterday on another site.
Dave it was always good reading your posts and you lasted way longer than I thought you would. By the way Dave is alive and well elsewhere on the web.
I saw an application for Forum Jackass yesterday on another site.
10-06-2006, 05:52 AM
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If I may throw my 2 cents in here:
I don't have a dog in this fight. I didn't even know about the argument, don't have an opinion on the outcome, and have interacted civilly with both xviper and I_heart_my_DB8. As someone who doesn't own an S2000, I rarely leave the Car Talk forum, and only occasionally post here to raise some hackles in politics.
But whenever I see a "newbies versus old guard" dispute, one of the big issues is always the general animosity of the veterans for answering the same questions, dealing with the same issues, and rehashing the same arguments every 6 months or so.
So I have a solution. One of the big issues I have with the format of this site is the Search function. Most forums have the ability to target a specific forum, receive results in either thread or post form, search by either member or keyword, etc. The search here offers very little of that, and the results seem to be limited to twelve, and based on some unknown (?) criteria. A search for "S2000" brings up the first result as a thread from October 2004, and it seems to grab some posts with a high incidence of the phrase, rather than the most recent or relevent. I don't know how much functionality can be changed on the board regarding the search, but in my experience, boards that have a good search, well-backed-up archives, and a culture of ENCOURAGING (not badgering) people to search and continue a relevent older thread, rather than mocking them for bringing up an old one, are more successful, especially in a technical forum. I'm sure I'd get sick of seeing "Whats teh bestest CAI for my s2kkk?????" 50 times a day, and it would wear on me after a while. And it would bother me even more so if in the past I had already laid out some well-researched answers and discussion, and I had some newbie questioning my quick reply to his most recent repost of the question. Not saying this is exactly the case, but I think it contributes to the head-butting between veterans and new memebers. We/you do a good job with stickies as a source of forum knowledge (especially in the Electronics forum), but I think a good search engine and archives system goes a long way towards having a solid board knowledge base on a given subject, and results in 2 or 3 really deep threads on a given topic (esp. technical) rather than 500 "what should I buy?" threads. Encourage (in a friendly way!!!!) people to SEARCH for the answer to their question, and only continue the discussion if new questions or information is available.
Now, an even deeper and more controversial addition to this (and, I admit, harder to implement in this forum) is to change the way post counts and PPD are viewed here. On the most successful/useful forum I use, there are 4 technical forums, a general discussion one, and some sale/trade ones. But, you only get credit for posts in the technical forums. What this means is that if you post in a technical forum, and someone with 1000+ posts answers your question (after you searched!!!), you know it's probably solid information. But if you get in a political argument in General Discussion, everyone knows that your opinion is only supported by your words, not your post count. Additionally, there's no way to "pad" your post count with fluff GD posts and then pass yourself off as an expert in the tech forums. It would be hard to implement that here, with soooo many forums, but I would kill postcounts/PPDs altogether. I think too often it encourages infighting, and a sense of entitlement among those of high post counts, and it encourages needless pilling on by those who consider their PPD as a reflection on their worth. Let everyone's words speak for themselves, and don't allow them to draw that newbie/veteran line to hide behind.
So yeah, I'm some freeloading guest asking for some significant changes in the board, I realize that. But honestly, while I enjoy S2ki, it isn't my "home forum." I enjoy lurking in vintage, and I enjoy car talk, but other than that there isn't much of real value to me here. So please don't consider my suggestions some self-serving request; I just think it is a significant part of the problem, and a potentially easy fix that would probably go a long way towards bringing peace to the S2ki universe.
-Chris
I don't have a dog in this fight. I didn't even know about the argument, don't have an opinion on the outcome, and have interacted civilly with both xviper and I_heart_my_DB8. As someone who doesn't own an S2000, I rarely leave the Car Talk forum, and only occasionally post here to raise some hackles in politics.
But whenever I see a "newbies versus old guard" dispute, one of the big issues is always the general animosity of the veterans for answering the same questions, dealing with the same issues, and rehashing the same arguments every 6 months or so.
So I have a solution. One of the big issues I have with the format of this site is the Search function. Most forums have the ability to target a specific forum, receive results in either thread or post form, search by either member or keyword, etc. The search here offers very little of that, and the results seem to be limited to twelve, and based on some unknown (?) criteria. A search for "S2000" brings up the first result as a thread from October 2004, and it seems to grab some posts with a high incidence of the phrase, rather than the most recent or relevent. I don't know how much functionality can be changed on the board regarding the search, but in my experience, boards that have a good search, well-backed-up archives, and a culture of ENCOURAGING (not badgering) people to search and continue a relevent older thread, rather than mocking them for bringing up an old one, are more successful, especially in a technical forum. I'm sure I'd get sick of seeing "Whats teh bestest CAI for my s2kkk?????" 50 times a day, and it would wear on me after a while. And it would bother me even more so if in the past I had already laid out some well-researched answers and discussion, and I had some newbie questioning my quick reply to his most recent repost of the question. Not saying this is exactly the case, but I think it contributes to the head-butting between veterans and new memebers. We/you do a good job with stickies as a source of forum knowledge (especially in the Electronics forum), but I think a good search engine and archives system goes a long way towards having a solid board knowledge base on a given subject, and results in 2 or 3 really deep threads on a given topic (esp. technical) rather than 500 "what should I buy?" threads. Encourage (in a friendly way!!!!) people to SEARCH for the answer to their question, and only continue the discussion if new questions or information is available.
Now, an even deeper and more controversial addition to this (and, I admit, harder to implement in this forum) is to change the way post counts and PPD are viewed here. On the most successful/useful forum I use, there are 4 technical forums, a general discussion one, and some sale/trade ones. But, you only get credit for posts in the technical forums. What this means is that if you post in a technical forum, and someone with 1000+ posts answers your question (after you searched!!!), you know it's probably solid information. But if you get in a political argument in General Discussion, everyone knows that your opinion is only supported by your words, not your post count. Additionally, there's no way to "pad" your post count with fluff GD posts and then pass yourself off as an expert in the tech forums. It would be hard to implement that here, with soooo many forums, but I would kill postcounts/PPDs altogether. I think too often it encourages infighting, and a sense of entitlement among those of high post counts, and it encourages needless pilling on by those who consider their PPD as a reflection on their worth. Let everyone's words speak for themselves, and don't allow them to draw that newbie/veteran line to hide behind.
So yeah, I'm some freeloading guest asking for some significant changes in the board, I realize that. But honestly, while I enjoy S2ki, it isn't my "home forum." I enjoy lurking in vintage, and I enjoy car talk, but other than that there isn't much of real value to me here. So please don't consider my suggestions some self-serving request; I just think it is a significant part of the problem, and a potentially easy fix that would probably go a long way towards bringing peace to the S2ki universe.
-Chris
10-06-2006, 05:53 AM
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Originally Posted by speed_bump,Oct 6 2006, 09:29 AM
If they would fix the %#$^&$% search engine on this site maybe Dave wouldn't have reached the point where that little thing pushed him over the edge.
10-06-2006, 06:14 AM
#90
Registered User
Originally Posted by MsPerky,Oct 6 2006, 11:16 AM
Not sure what thread this quote was in, but it is an indication of cthree's (Erik's) opinion on the subject:
QUOTE (cthree @ Oct 5 2006, 03:23 PM)
Oh the drama. I'm fed up with Dave having a melt down biannually. After 5.5 years and 38000 posts you would think you would learn to get along and not take things personally. If nate does things for people and doesn't want them copied then that's his right and it's not xviper's right to challenge that.
I think nate is fighting a losing battle. I think nate's s2000 illustrations violate Honda's trademark. Neither of those things are any of my business and I'm not going to get bent about it but Dave seems to think it's his and he seems to think it's worth going to the mat over. Whatever.
It is true that Dave would get fed up every now and then. But I, for one, was always glad he reconsidered. I'd like him to this time, also, but it doesn't look promising. Unfortunately, Erik sometimes doesn't have a way with words, either.
QUOTE (cthree @ Oct 5 2006, 03:23 PM)
Oh the drama. I'm fed up with Dave having a melt down biannually. After 5.5 years and 38000 posts you would think you would learn to get along and not take things personally. If nate does things for people and doesn't want them copied then that's his right and it's not xviper's right to challenge that.
I think nate is fighting a losing battle. I think nate's s2000 illustrations violate Honda's trademark. Neither of those things are any of my business and I'm not going to get bent about it but Dave seems to think it's his and he seems to think it's worth going to the mat over. Whatever.
It is true that Dave would get fed up every now and then. But I, for one, was always glad he reconsidered. I'd like him to this time, also, but it doesn't look promising. Unfortunately, Erik sometimes doesn't have a way with words, either.
edited to state the actual truth of your statement.