S2000 Vintage Owners Knowledge, age and life experiences represent the members of the Vintage Owners

Cost of living

Thread Tools
 
Old 04-29-2008 | 03:52 PM
  #181  
Legal Bill's Avatar
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 34,113
Likes: 109
From: Canton, MA
Default

Originally Posted by boltonblue,Apr 29 2008, 04:31 PM
i didn't explain the whole picture.
one of the challenges with solar is rather obviously it is only available during the day.
energy storage becomes an issue.
that's where hydrogen comes in.
use the electricity during the day to hydrolyze water and get hydrogen.
that you can pipe all over the country.

oh and as far as new cars go:
one of the reason electrics cars fail in the marketplace is it takes to long to recharge the batteries.
hydrogen based fuel cells create electricity to drive motors and don't require huge banks of batteries.
you can recharge a hydrogen fuel tank at the fuel pump in about five minutes just like your car.
what is required is a distribution infrastructure to support this.
tell the gas companies they can keep their windfall profits but only if they invest in this infrastructure.
they get to stay happy and continue to make money.
we get clean air. carbon footprint goes to zero.
we get to tell OPEC go pound sand.
we keep another 50 billion a month in our economy.
we get a strategic industrial advantage on the rest of the world competitively.

BTW you can use hydrogen for home heating and local power generation at your house.
remember fuel cells can generate electricity.

so if spend one year of what we are pissing away in IRAQ on solar panel IR&D funding think where we could be. in 10 to 15 years.


end of rant
I'm going to get this wrong, but I thought that even if you covered the entire country with a solar panel or collector, you couldn't generate enough power (with current technology) to supply even half of the energy needs. It was something like that anyway.
Old 04-29-2008 | 07:40 PM
  #182  
RedY2KS2k's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 5,296
Likes: 1
From: Delaware, OH
Default

Originally Posted by Legal Bill,Apr 29 2008, 01:15 PM
...Also, my son will be moving back in with us to re-start college (thank god) so it will be nice to have the room for the next two or three years.
That's great news, Bill. We all wish him the best in his new endeavor.
Old 04-29-2008 | 07:46 PM
  #183  
RedY2KS2k's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 5,296
Likes: 1
From: Delaware, OH
Default

Originally Posted by Zippy,Apr 29 2008, 01:37 PM
...
Since I am trying to keeps this in the main forum, I will not point fingers at who has been spending the money...
As the late Walt Kelly said in the Pogo comic strip, "We have met the enemy and he is us."

Just look at the support for the "stimulus package." Hot new flash: it won't be paid for by Bush, it will be paid for by your grandchildren.

Look at the "gasoline tax holiday." The gas tax funds roads. Does anyone really believe that our roads are too good and that we should cut maintenance on them? Yet the idea apparently has widespread support.

And remember that one person's "earmark" is another's "entitlement."
Old 04-29-2008 | 07:54 PM
  #184  
RedY2KS2k's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 5,296
Likes: 1
From: Delaware, OH
Default

One additional observation. Many of us own our sports cars, but drive something else for the daily commute. How many of the people you know who "need" an SUV drive it only on those occasions they need it but drive a cheapo for the daily solo commute?
Old 04-29-2008 | 08:16 PM
  #185  
ralper's Avatar
Gold Member (Premium)
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 32,737
Likes: 1,497
From: Randolph, NJ
Default

Originally Posted by RedY2KS2k,Apr 29 2008, 10:54 PM
One additional observation. Many of us own our sports cars, but drive something else for the daily commute. How many of the people you know who "need" an SUV drive it only on those occasions they need it but drive a cheapo for the daily solo commute?
I commute to work every day on New Jersey's legendary congested roads. At least 50% and possibly more of the vehicles are SUVs. Of them at least 90% or 9 out of every 10 are single occupant. People own SUVs because they want to own them, not necessarily because they need to own them, in spite of what many of the owners say.

I think that there are currently two very powerful forces at work which will (hopefully) change the proportions. One is the price of a gallon of gas. I expect that it will continue to increase and as it passes the $4.00 mark and heads towards the $5.00 dollar mark more and more people will be getting rid of their SUVs in favor of smaller more efficient cars or perhaps crossovers. Even if they could continue to drive their SUVs for a few years more, the thought of pouring that much money into the fuel tank each week and sometimes twice a week will nag at them until they get rid of the monster.

The second force is the social stigma that is attached to owning an SUV. This might even be a stronger force than the price of a gallon of gas. As it becomes more and more politically and socially incorrect to own an SUV more and more people will get rid of them in favor of smaller cars and/or crossovers. Even if it doesn't make sense from a dollar and cents point of view to do this, the social stigma associated with owning a gas guzzling vehicle will be too strong a force to resist.

I think at that point a lot of the people who absolutely needed an SUV for one reason or another will find that the smaller more fuel efficient vehicle suits them just fine.

If you think back to the 1970s, after the gas shortages and rapid increases in price, you'll remember that many, if not all, people got rid of their full size cars even when it didn't make sense economically. Up until that point they absolutely had to drive full size cars, but after the gas shortages and increase in prices their thinking changed quickly. I think we are on the verge of seeing history repeat itself.


(These are my opinions. Like them or don't, they are still my opinions. Whether or not you agree with them is your choice. If you agree that's fine, if not that's fine too. Feel free to state your opinion, but please, no flames, no personal attacks, no finger pointing and no silly, nonsensical ranting and raving.)
Old 04-29-2008 | 09:09 PM
  #186  
vtec9's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 10,106
Likes: 5
From: Connecticut
Default

[QUOTE=Legal Bill,Apr 29 2008, 07:52 PM] I'm going to get this wrong, but I thought that even if you covered the entire country with a solar panel or collector, you couldn't generate enough power (with current technology) to supply even half of the energy needs.
Old 04-29-2008 | 09:24 PM
  #187  
ralper's Avatar
Gold Member (Premium)
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 32,737
Likes: 1,497
From: Randolph, NJ
Default

Actually it was my understanding that the electricity from the solar panels would be used to hydrolyze the water and provide the hydrogen that could be shipped to the filling stations across the country. Therefore you really wouldn't need quite so many solar panels as you would if you were relying on them to provide energy in general.
Old 04-29-2008 | 09:30 PM
  #188  
vtec9's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 10,106
Likes: 5
From: Connecticut
Default

Storage, transport, infrastructure aside.. it's just presented as an eye opener. I don't think it's very realistic to place 65,813 square miles of solar panels in one place.. but we don't really need Nevada.
Old 04-29-2008 | 11:12 PM
  #189  
paS2K's Avatar
Registered User
Gold Member (Premium)
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 18,875
Likes: 31
From: Philly (Narberth)
Default

[QUOTE=dlq04,Apr 29 2008, 04:22 PM] The market place will decide what the next type of transportation will be. ....According to Autoline Detroit the magic number for consumer rethinking is $3.50 or more a gallon.
Old 04-29-2008 | 11:26 PM
  #190  
NNY S2k's Avatar
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 25,134
Likes: 330
From: Plattsburgh, NY
Default

What will become of all the suv's if people stop driving them....the junk yard?


Quick Reply: Cost of living



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 02:26 AM.