RACER

[QUOTE=GrandMasterKhan,Jun 17 2007, 09:55 PM]
I attempted to spin the tires in order to turn the car quickly out of a lookout.

Jsmply

That's why your clutch is wasted




There are many different types of road surfaces's. Some road surfaces allow for wheel spin depending on the type of asphalt, angle, speed, ect. It's easier to spin the tires while the car is already in motion, especially if you are turning the steering wheel, rather than to spin the wheels from a standstill





This is the real test. Find a long, straight uphill road, and mash on the throttle at about 55-60 mph in 5th gear on a steep section of road. If the clutch is good, it won't slip in this scenario. If it slip's, or is starting to, then it's time to start shopping for some part's [/QUOTE]


Test out the clutch and evaluate its condition. I do agree though that it is possible you are asking a lot of your clutch and may legitimately be wearing it down with such habbits, especially with the CDV still in.

RED MX5

Right out of the box, the S2000 is a very reliable and tough little car. Billman has suggested that the heavier flywheel and CDV work together to minimize the magnitude of over rev during a money shift, and whether or not that is why they are there, it is clearly one of the advantages. If you ever miss a shift the heavy flywheel and CDV could save your engine, and you need to realize that kind of thing before you start changing stuff. Every mod has both advantages, and disadvantages.

Saki GT

Personally, I think the pressure plate in the AP2 is not firm enough to grip with the heavier flywheel Honda put in, regardless of the CDV. More than a few AP2 owners have reported pulling the CDV and still experiencing slip, sometimes worse than before.

There's really no need to drive around trying to chirp the tires all the time, just be smooth with your shifting and you'll still be fast. You can remove the CDV and put it backl in, but personally, I'd just keep it in.

GrandMasterKhan

I think you guys might have misinterpeted what I said. I do not ALWAYS chrip the tires on the 1-2 shift. lol I drive sensibly most all the time. I meant to say that the tires would always chirp on the 1-2s shift (instead of clutch slippage..thus indication good grip of the clutch)

Your right Jsmply. It is rare for the Ap2 to chirp the tires on the 1-2 shift. Which is why I was surprised i was able to make mine do so so easily when I had my oem 245 tires. so for the longest time I wasnt 100% sure if my car even HAD a CDV. (btw i have tested the car with the 5th/6th gear clutch tests and it always passes)

I rarely beat on my car. I always RPM match while downshifting and upshifting and always attempt to ensure a smooth and jerk free shifting during DD. I sometimes feel that the CDV may be counterproductive to such smooth driving finesse. The car seems to lack the crispness I would expect likely due to the combination of the CDV and the heavy flywheel. I guess i need to bite the bullet and remove the CDV.

The two instances I described in my first posts are the ONLY times I have ever attempted to spin the tires on dry pavement. Both times I was in motion during a turn. I agree it is easier to chirp the tires on the ap1. Then again the Ap2 does have more tire in the rear (and mine has 255s in the rear)

I agree that the pressure plate on the AP2 is not strong enough to suit the heavier flywheel of the AP2. I have strongly considered swapping to the Ap1 flywheel if I stay NA. Though I have put off any clutch/flywheel decisions since I do have plans of FI.


My whole question is based on the inconsistancy i have experiance with the clutch. I feel its likely the fault of the CDV so i'll be undertaking its removeal shortly.

RACER

With four brand new OEM tires, I wouldn't dream of trying to light up the tires

Jsmply

I understand your frustrations. I don't know if it was the CDV, the heavier flywheel, the pressure plate, what is was . . . my OEM setup was just NOT consistent. I would ALWAYS pass the 5th gear test, like you said you did. I even found a parking garage with an incline and passed there as well . . . but on hard shifts, sometimes the RPM's would literally HANG at redline . . . it could not have been my feet-work, at least I don't see how. When I would shift at redline in say 2nd-3rd or 3rd-4th . . . sometimes I would get a smooth shift, but more often than not the RPM's would hang around redline AFTER I already engaged the next gear for about a second or so . . then they would slowly drop and catch. It was bizare and very frustrating.

I had the CDV removed, this helped a lot but the situation still happended on occasion. Later I did the TSB for the AP2 popping out of 2nd gear . . . while they were in there I had the hardtopguy kit installed. I have never had any complications at all since then.

If you are considering a change, do the CDV first. Its not some big thing that you cannot reverse. Its cheap and easy. Either modify your slave cylinder, or just buy an 00-03 one. Modifying your stock one is very easy though assuming you are somewhat handy. If you want to change the clutch/flywheel/pressure plate . . . consider the hardtopguy kit. He says it works with boosted cars that are putting down some very good numbers . . . so it works insanely well with any N/A setup. I absolutely LOVE mine. One of the best mods for the car. The ACT pressure plate he includes feels awesome and there is no need to change the clutch to some monster disc unless you are putting down some insane power. All it will do is add more stress to the drive-line and shock the diff more, etc.

Post back and let us know how things work out for you.

GrandMasterKhan

I also just had the TSB for 1st/2nd gear popping out done. Damn that was annoying. I had to take videos of it popping out of first because it NEVER did it whenever I took the car to the dealer. But it would pop out of first all the time, sometimes several times in a row.


I strongly considering swapping to an AP1 Flywheel and installing a new clutch when i had the TSB performed. But honestly the tranny in general was pissing me off so much i wasnt sure if i even wanted to keep the car. Its fine now with the exception of the CDV which i'll be removing tomorrow.

trump26901

!!! ther is a TSB about it... gotta find that. I'll look, but can someone send me a link. I've noticed that in my car. I was going to call the dealer about it, but I just haven't had the time.

Jsmply

The specific TSB we are talking about is for AP2 trannies. Not sure if there is something similiar that might help you with the AP1 (if your profile is accurate and you have an AP1). The TSB I remember hearing the most about for the AP1 is a tranny grind, not popping out of gear. Regardless here is the TSB we are talking about in case you have an AP2:

05-009
Transmission Pops Out of 2nd Gear
SYMPTOM
The transmission intermittently pops out of second
gear on high RPM deceleration.
CORRECTIVE ACTION
Replace the countershaft 1st gear and the 2nd
gear set.
PARTS INFORMATION
First Gear:
P/N 23421-PCY-010, H/C 7596869
Second Gear Set:
P/N 23432-PCY-316, H/C 7596893
REQUIRED MATERIALS
Honda Manual Transmission Fluid
(1.7 quarts required per vehicle):
P/N 08798-9016, H/C 4928271
WARRANTY CLAIM INFORMATION
In warranty: The normal warranty applies.
Operation Number: 213205
Flat Rate Time: 8.2
Failed Part: P/N 23432-PCY-316
H/C 7596893
Defect Code: 03214
Symptom Code: 03701