VErsion 2 Toda cams
07-31-2003, 03:12 PM
#231
there are others better suited to answer the valve question really. Personally I think if you aren't raising the redline don't bother. It's expensive and won't give you anything you don't have at the current redline. If you wanted 10,000 or even 11,000 then you definitely have to upgrade.
Yes.... I am having the av crisis.... I think it's time for fry to come back.....
Yes.... I am having the av crisis.... I think it's time for fry to come back.....
07-31-2003, 03:19 PM
#232
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Thread Starter
Hi guys.....
What i got from asking people was the lighter vavles will not really help in HP gain. It helps by reducing weight on the value train = less work done. What you want to do is to have a Port ad polished head with oversized values installed.... I think chris CBJ80 and ChrisD were the only two guys that have this. Both the heads were developed by two different people. One the famous yet infamous Mike Simon and the other is Alaniz.........
two more days till dyno day...hek hek.....
Beroz
What i got from asking people was the lighter vavles will not really help in HP gain. It helps by reducing weight on the value train = less work done. What you want to do is to have a Port ad polished head with oversized values installed.... I think chris CBJ80 and ChrisD were the only two guys that have this. Both the heads were developed by two different people. One the famous yet infamous Mike Simon and the other is Alaniz.........
two more days till dyno day...hek hek.....
Beroz
08-01-2003, 11:01 AM
#234
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Ultimate Lurker is a friend with Joe Alaniz, and I am sure he will tell you that Alaniz is basically the leader with this head. He has spent tons of time on it, and now does heads for road race teams all over the world. I started talking with him again regarding future work with the head, and there is potential to step it up a hair over the porting that I have, it would be interesting to see what that would result in.....
Chris
Chris
08-01-2003, 01:56 PM
#235
Dyno'd at UL's this afternoon and have some mundane but interesting results. The car seems to consistently pull 2-3 hp more than stock-cams. What's better is my AFR is off .5 to 1.0 point, so the car was running around 11.5 with a spike to 12.0 at 6000..... so it is definately rich after all..... wacky. I'll post the plots when I'm at a scanner
08-01-2003, 02:06 PM
#238
the curve is exactly the same. just add 2 hp....... 
UL said that there is some hp hiding in the AFR. 11.5 is pretty darn rich IMHOand after 8000 it heads down to 11........ I definitely believe it can be tuned up, just gotta figure what to do about engine management..... this is all stock ECU, btw, no VAFC or anything.
Whats interesting is the cams actually stayed above the stock cams in power while running richer, so theoretically if the AFR can be restored the power should good up, so I have hopes
UL said that there is some hp hiding in the AFR. 11.5 is pretty darn rich IMHOand after 8000 it heads down to 11........ I definitely believe it can be tuned up, just gotta figure what to do about engine management..... this is all stock ECU, btw, no VAFC or anything.
Whats interesting is the cams actually stayed above the stock cams in power while running richer, so theoretically if the AFR can be restored the power should good up, so I have hopes
08-01-2003, 02:54 PM
#240
Registered User
Yeah, Joe is currently on top of the game with Honda heads. He does the headwork on the worlds quickest all-motor Honda (9.99@134 mph from 2.2 liters all-motor!) and has done the headwork for 4-5 10-second all-motor cars. He also does the heads for Andy Hope's team (current leader in the West Coast Honda Challenge H1 class) and a variety of other teams.
We all need to bug Sideways to install his head. We've got lots of dyno data on his car, and his head is done - so install and come dyno! He even gets free dyno time! Sorry to put you on the spot buddy, I want to see the results! :-)
In terms of the cams, the results, while not spectacular, are encouraging (vapors knows what I'm talking about). Additional hp (and there were gains all the way across up to about 8300 rpm, then the curve matched the old one) is always nice, and given that the stiffer valve springs will cost 1-2 hp, this isn't bad (not great though).
The fact that the car was running consistently richer was interesting. First, it tells me there is more power to be liberated. I'd say at least 2-3 more just by bring the mixture back up to where it was before. But more importantly, I have to ask - why is it richer? These are bigger, more aggressive cams, and while they might run richer down low, they should be leaner up top. I suspect that something to do with the cam angle sensors is in play as they control fuel injector timing, but I can't say for sure.
At a minimum, they didn't lose any hp which is a good thing. I believe Wicky will be doing a Toda header soon, so we'll see if that helps lean things out (as it did in Prolene's car).
UL
We all need to bug Sideways to install his head. We've got lots of dyno data on his car, and his head is done - so install and come dyno! He even gets free dyno time! Sorry to put you on the spot buddy, I want to see the results! :-)
In terms of the cams, the results, while not spectacular, are encouraging (vapors knows what I'm talking about). Additional hp (and there were gains all the way across up to about 8300 rpm, then the curve matched the old one) is always nice, and given that the stiffer valve springs will cost 1-2 hp, this isn't bad (not great though).
The fact that the car was running consistently richer was interesting. First, it tells me there is more power to be liberated. I'd say at least 2-3 more just by bring the mixture back up to where it was before. But more importantly, I have to ask - why is it richer? These are bigger, more aggressive cams, and while they might run richer down low, they should be leaner up top. I suspect that something to do with the cam angle sensors is in play as they control fuel injector timing, but I can't say for sure.
At a minimum, they didn't lose any hp which is a good thing. I believe Wicky will be doing a Toda header soon, so we'll see if that helps lean things out (as it did in Prolene's car).
UL