Synthetic Gear Lubricant
11-23-2010, 01:51 PM
#14
Originally Posted by Swiftoy,Nov 23 2010, 06:37 PM
Lol, I know the feeling. 
x 3 , lol. Unfortunately mine has little dog syndrome and it shows no sign of going away 
11-23-2010, 01:51 PM
#15
First argument: Mixing different viscosities does NOT produce a viscosity that equates to an average of the two mixed.
This is not baking where you're dealing with dissolved ingredients. When you mix different viscosities they don't blend to make an averaged viscosity - it creates a distribution of independent and different sized molecules. Think of it as going to a fast food joint and showing up with a truck load of basketballs that you mix into the crazy ball pit your kid loves to roll around in. The balls in the pit don't magically turn into medium-sized balls -- you just have a pit full of big balls and small balls -- and the distribution of molecules still obeys the laws of centripetal forces, which ultimately leads to an uneven distribution of viscosities during operation.
Second point - Mobil 1 is used in expensive cars because they sign into shared marketing partnerships that benefit both companies. You think M1 is great because it's used in all those cars you'd love to own - but can't afford. M1 benefits because they get folks to think their product is so incredibly great because it's used in expensive cars.
Fact - Standard Mobil 1 is not much better than most conventional oils out there. The only benefit is temperature stability, which is irrelevant unless it's the only oil you can get in extremely cold climates. Mobil 1 is not a bad oil - it's just not a great oil.
Amsoil and Redline are much better oils. That has been proven in numerous and repeated industry standardized tests. They are however considered "boutique" oils because they are not produced in the quantities oils like Mobil 1 are produced.
The first thing you should do when looking at an oil is to ignore the marketing aspect. Some of the WORST oils are the most heavily marketed -- Lucas, Royal Purple, anything by Slick 50. If race teams are overly sponsored by an oil -- I tend to shy away from the oil unless it's been proven by independent labs using standardized tests. Then if it's a good oil -- expect to pay a huge premium to cover the cost the company foots for all that marketing.
Mobil 1 has been one of the best marketed oils ever produced -- and continues to be so. Mobil 1 was released after Amsoil came on the market. Mobil 1 was responsible for the destruction of quite a few motors in its early years, and is responsible for the origin and propagation of every bad synthetic oil story that unfortunately lingers to this day.
"Synthetic is bad for engine seals, it's bad for rotary engines, you can't change back once you switch to it, your car will leak terribly if you use it..." all those negative attributes were valid a long time ago - valid for Mobil 1. Other synthetic oils suffered not only due to the anti-competitive behavior of Mobil oil company, they suffered due to the bumblings of Mobil attempting to muscle tiny Amsoil (previously Amzoil) out of the market by mass marketing a poorly designed and engineered product, rushed to market to smash the tiny competitor.
Luckily - Amsoil has survived due to it's much better performance. It's survived even though the company insisted on using a terrible multi-level marketing scheme. Luckily you don't have to deal with that - you can buy it from the source.
This is not baking where you're dealing with dissolved ingredients. When you mix different viscosities they don't blend to make an averaged viscosity - it creates a distribution of independent and different sized molecules. Think of it as going to a fast food joint and showing up with a truck load of basketballs that you mix into the crazy ball pit your kid loves to roll around in. The balls in the pit don't magically turn into medium-sized balls -- you just have a pit full of big balls and small balls -- and the distribution of molecules still obeys the laws of centripetal forces, which ultimately leads to an uneven distribution of viscosities during operation.
Second point - Mobil 1 is used in expensive cars because they sign into shared marketing partnerships that benefit both companies. You think M1 is great because it's used in all those cars you'd love to own - but can't afford. M1 benefits because they get folks to think their product is so incredibly great because it's used in expensive cars.
Fact - Standard Mobil 1 is not much better than most conventional oils out there. The only benefit is temperature stability, which is irrelevant unless it's the only oil you can get in extremely cold climates. Mobil 1 is not a bad oil - it's just not a great oil.
Amsoil and Redline are much better oils. That has been proven in numerous and repeated industry standardized tests. They are however considered "boutique" oils because they are not produced in the quantities oils like Mobil 1 are produced.
The first thing you should do when looking at an oil is to ignore the marketing aspect. Some of the WORST oils are the most heavily marketed -- Lucas, Royal Purple, anything by Slick 50. If race teams are overly sponsored by an oil -- I tend to shy away from the oil unless it's been proven by independent labs using standardized tests. Then if it's a good oil -- expect to pay a huge premium to cover the cost the company foots for all that marketing.
Mobil 1 has been one of the best marketed oils ever produced -- and continues to be so. Mobil 1 was released after Amsoil came on the market. Mobil 1 was responsible for the destruction of quite a few motors in its early years, and is responsible for the origin and propagation of every bad synthetic oil story that unfortunately lingers to this day.
"Synthetic is bad for engine seals, it's bad for rotary engines, you can't change back once you switch to it, your car will leak terribly if you use it..." all those negative attributes were valid a long time ago - valid for Mobil 1. Other synthetic oils suffered not only due to the anti-competitive behavior of Mobil oil company, they suffered due to the bumblings of Mobil attempting to muscle tiny Amsoil (previously Amzoil) out of the market by mass marketing a poorly designed and engineered product, rushed to market to smash the tiny competitor.
Luckily - Amsoil has survived due to it's much better performance. It's survived even though the company insisted on using a terrible multi-level marketing scheme. Luckily you don't have to deal with that - you can buy it from the source.
11-24-2010, 12:17 PM
#19
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rrounds Posted on Nov 23 2010, 11:11 PM
What diff temps have you recorded so far, and how/where?
After installing the 4.57's A while back I measured diff temps in these spots.
At "E" it was the highest because there was some oil around the fill plug so there was the best heat transfer.
IIRc the average temp I measured was 63C on a 22,4C
day.
With this.
Did you see anything way above 70C?
After a spirited drive I measuerd 69C diff oil* temp, with an ambient temp of 18C.
* measured the oil itself within minutes after driving.
This was with SAE 190 in a 4.57 diff.
I won't know if my "mix" will lower the temps in the rear end or not till I put it in. I only have 9 temp. readings of my rear end so far, I will get about 20 before I switch to the "mix" if it lowers the temps(less friction then I will post back(but this will take some time) if the temps. go up then I'll try something else. Straight 90w gets real thin at the temps I have recorded so far.
After installing the 4.57's A while back I measured diff temps in these spots.
At "E" it was the highest because there was some oil around the fill plug so there was the best heat transfer.
IIRc the average temp I measured was 63C on a 22,4C
day.With this.
Did you see anything way above 70C?
After a spirited drive I measuerd 69C diff oil* temp, with an ambient temp of 18C.
* measured the oil itself within minutes after driving.
This was with SAE 190 in a 4.57 diff.
11-29-2010, 06:41 PM
#20
Thread Starter
On my temp readings so far(highest) after 45 miles at 60 to 70 mph I get 158*f (70*c) with a outside temp of 47*f (8.3*c). I take my temp readings at the flat pad right behind the drain plug as seen in your picture. I also have readings after 8 miles of freeway as this is how far it is to my wife's work. 
I don't think I'll wait for the weather to warm up because if it gets this hot after 45 miles in cold weather I don't think I want to know how hot it gets in hot(100*+) weather. We have a long drive(460 miles) planed for the end of the month, I'll get some readings after 100 miles of 80+ mph and see if it gets hotter as the miles and speed go up.
ROD
I don't think I'll wait for the weather to warm up because if it gets this hot after 45 miles in cold weather I don't think I want to know how hot it gets in hot(100*+) weather. We have a long drive(460 miles) planed for the end of the month, I'll get some readings after 100 miles of 80+ mph and see if it gets hotter as the miles and speed go up.
ROD
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