hirev

This is my experience, not open for argument, it's just my experience. I have wrenched cars for over 50 years as a hobby. I have owned 27 cars. My honda is mine since new(10/03 it's a 04 ap2). I have done every oil change. I hand tighten the filters, using the correct honda filter. I use 10/30 wt chevron from costco I buy by the case. I have 81,000 miles on my car and I have never had to add oil, notice a leak, or burning of same. When it is time to remove and change filter it is hand tight so no tool is needed.
It's called experience i guess.

the last time I went to a speedy oil change place, not with my honda, they did not tighten the filter and it leaked within 2 miles, I removed filter and change oil again and never went back.

Currently I also change the oil on my v8 1999 jaguar xk8, it takes synthetic and about 8 quarts. I have change the oil twice, hand tighten the Bosch filter and when it was time to change it came right off hand tightened. No leaks (for a British car?)

cosmomiller

Will that guarantee the same results in the future? No. What is the experience of professionals? Not hand tight. Research S2000 engine fires, almost all caused by oil filter oil leaks. Guess how they were installed and what type (non-OEM) they were.

If you wife/GF said she goes to bed with lighted candles burning in the house and has never had a problem in "her experience", are you going to sleep soundly?

Here is the difference between the standard hand tight filter and the OEM one for the S2000. Once again you can easily see the 2 metal rings designed to make contact with the filter mating surface on the engine block.

hirev

So you point is that past experience is not necessarily indicative of future performance? Good argument, cannot dispute that argument ever about candles or oil filters or the sun coming up .

noodels

Used Hamp short,<had to re tighten 3x & a K&N had to re tighten x2 >they bottom out metal on tightening.
Honda oem as above < the correct spec one > had no probs, I hand tighten <both hands> I will never go Non oem again regarding oil filter.....
Many years trained & hobby
Also bear in mind, its near exhaust manifold so is subject to extreme conditions.

DanielB

Go back a few decades and the argument was made that since some people had smoked all their life without getting cancer, then it was safe. But many others didn't have that good luck. And, of course, there is now enough analytical data to show the direct connection.

Same thing here. Some may have been able to hand tighten the filter without a leak or worse, but it's not best practice, or even what the engineers at Honda who designed the car recommend. I suppose one could argue there is not enough analytical data to show that an improperly tightened filter will leak. However, common sense says that maybe the filter should be tighter, and indeed, the engineers at Honda called out a specific way to tighten the filter. It's different than most other cars, and when done properly, the filter doesn't leak.

All that said, I really don't understand why we're even having this discussion. Just tighten the filter per Honda's recommendation and go drive

noodels

Bravo

cosmomiller

Matters of fact, which are the second objects of human reason, are not ascertained in the same manner; nor is our evidence of their truth, however great, of a like nature with the foregoing. The contrary of every matter of fact is still possible, because it can never imply a contradiction, and is conceived by the mind with the same facility and distinctness, as if ever so conformable to reality. That the sun will not rise tomorrow is no less intelligible a proposition, and implies no more contradiction, than the affirmation, that it will rise. We should in vain, therefore, attempt to demonstrate its falsehood. Were it demonstratively false, it would imply a contradiction, and could never be distinctly conceived by the mind.

This problem of induction, which you dragged improperly into past oil filter performance does not compare well at all. We have evidence of the failure of hand tightened oil filters. Not so the sun. Nice try but no dice.

Chuck S

Even my lawn mower has a torque spec for the oil filter after it contacts the engine: 10-12 NM (88.5 - 106.n lb-in) or 1/2 to 3/4 turn.

One-off experiences are rarely useful. Outliers can exist in every sample and neither prove nor disprove anything. Non-specific example below. Whatever this is plotting I'd not rely on the outlier.



-- Chuck

B serious

Well...its also more difficult to do it incorrectly. Idk why on Earth you wouldn't tighten it with a tool. Just because you haven't had an issue YET doesn't mean the likelihood of having one in the future is low.

A S2000 OEM PCX filter is not a traditional filter that can be reliably tightened by hand.

The filter needs 18LB-FT.

Its got a radius of like 1.56". So you'd need to grip the smooth outer case of the filter hard enough to be able to exert a tightening force of ~140LB to reach 18LB-FT.

So...no...you can't do it by hand.

and...you're pretty far from "safe" with a hand tightened filter. Or you're a complete monster of a man. Either way...your experience will not translate to normal humans.

I could advertise that I used my fingers and MASSIVE strength and effort to tighten the drain plug with "zero problems", and that I usually torque bolts using my teeth to grip them....

But...why? Just use a tool. Its easier and more foolproof.

Its not a traditional filter. Its meant to be torqued by a tool. Its easier to use the tool than to ride the struggle bus and still not arrive at the destination.

I don't understand why tf anyone wouldn't just do it correctly.

B serious

Also to be clear, I don't care how anyone tightens anything on their own car as it has no effect on my life.

It just doesn't make any logical sense to do it wrong when doing it right is more easy....