CenturionS2K

All - I have a 2008 and changed the oil last weekend with Mobil 1. Added 5.1 qts per my owner's manual. COLD today gave me fully covered diamonds on both sides of the stick (with one side slightly higher). Also did a HOT check today: 1) warmed up engine to 3-4 bars; 2) shut off engine; 3) removed stick and waited about 4 minutes; 4) place back stick and wiped off oi; 5) placed stick by in for a reading. My hot reading is 2 full diamonds on one side and just about 3 full diamonds on the other side of the stick. I did three separate reading and consistently receive the same results. Does this indicate that I should add more oil and get the lower stick to at least 4 diamonds in a HOT check? I expected a higher reading HOT then COLD. Thoughts would be appreciated. Note: I have not driven the car since changing the oil last weekend. I am in the south, so whether conditions are about 80-85 degrees still. I took about 3-4 minutes to reach 3-4 bars to warm up the engine.

Thanks for the feedback. Trying to get this right.

xviper

Yes, you must top it up. You must realize that immediately after you've done an oil change and you have not started the engine up to circulate and warm up the oil, a "cold" check is not yet possible because you have not filled the oil filter or sent the oil to the various static points of the engine where the oil fell out after a "hot" oil change. Filling these regions and the filter can take upwards of 1/2 to 3/4 of a qt.
Always do an oil change, check that the dipstick shows near full before firing it up for the first time. After the next short driving cycle where the engine has gotten up to operating temps, THEN do a cold check the next day and top up. NOW, your oil change is complete. You should always also know the difference in dipstick readings between a proper hot check and a proper cold check so you don't overfill too much. Honda directs us to do the "hot" check but if you know the difference, a cold check is the easier read because there's less slop on the stick.

CenturionS2K

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Yes, you must top it up. You must realize that immediately after you've done an oil change and you have not started the engine up to circulate and warm up the oil, a "cold" check is not yet possible because you have not filled the oil filter or sent the oil to the various static points of the engine where the oil fell out after a "hot" oil change. Filling these regions and the filter can take upwards of 1/2 to 3/4 of a qt.
Always do an oil change, check that the dipstick shows near full before firing it up for the first time. After the next short driving cycle where the engine has gotten up to operating temps, THEN do a cold check the next day and top up. NOW, your oil change is complete. You should always also know the difference in dipstick readings between a proper hot check and a proper cold check so you don't overfill too much. Honda directs us to do the "hot" check but if you know the difference, a cold check is the easier read because there's less slop on the stick.
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Thank you for the excellent advice and good point the need to fill the oil filter for an accurate reading.

Recap and some additional inf from today's readings:

- although I did not drive the car last weekend after changing the oil (6-7 days ago), I did turn it on and let it run until I reached 3 bars.
- I did not drive or run the engine all week until this morning.
- before running the engine today, my COLD reading was full (all 5 diamonds covered)
- then, this morning, I ran the engine until reaching 4 bars. Shut engine off; removed dipstick and waited 4-5 minutes before getting the following HOT reading: 2 full diamonds on one side and just about 3 full diamonds on the other side
- about 10 min ago (around 3 hours after my reading above), I did another reading without running the engine (COLD but not "overnight COLD"): 4 full diamonds on one side and just about 4 diamonds on the lower side. 5th diamond not covered.

Next steps. Shall I:
1. Do an actual "drive" this afternoon for at least 10-15 minutes, then allow the car to sit overnight and do another COLD reading in the morning? Possible results and actions after option 1: a) If the COLD reading gives me at less than 5 diamonds (say, 4) shall I top it off to fill the 5th diamond, touching the H? b) is it necessary to do another HOT reading tomorrow morning if I drive the car today? If so, where should the HOT reading be? I would think that driving the car today for a short period will "ensure" the filter is full and all other areas of the engine get properly lubricated for a final, and accurate, COLD reading tomorrow and topping off to the H.

Question: Should I use the part of the dipstick with that gets the lowest reading to top it off?

2. Is step 1 the best approach?

Thanks again.

xviper

You must keep in mind that although your coolant temp gets up to the appropriate number of "bars", the oil temp always lags behind after a cold start. Cool oil will not flow well and it won't flow efficiently back into the oil pan. This is particularly so right after a complete drain like doing an oil change. Yes, you should go for a "proper, regular" drive and then check the oil the next morning as or when it is convenient. You know the level is more or less within the "X's" on the dipstick. This is more than adequate oil in the motor. Remember that so long as the oil is within the "hash" marks, the motor is safe. You can be right at the bottom of the dipstick at the "add" mark and the engine will still be safe.
Don't over-think this or obsess about it too much. You don't have to have exactly enough oil to put it at the "full" mark on the stick. I generally don't even bother with topping up until the level gets to below 1/2 on the stick, but I must admit that when I do an oil change, I'd like to see it topped up at least to start with. This is a good way to monitor and oil consumption that may be occurring. My 2000 AP1 only just stopped using oil this year.

xviper

PS. The filter should be full after you run the car for a couple of minutes after an oil change. But the oil won't flow back down into the pan for a good reading. Honda wants us to do a hot reading, so a cold reading will always give about 1 X above that. If you top up to the line when cold, the level should be more than fine. Then do all your checks cold and you'll be consistent. Use the side of the stick that gives you the lowest reading. The difference isn't significant (1 X), so don't worry about it.

CenturionS2K

Great stuff. Thank you! I will do a proper, regular, drive this afternoon, then will do a COLD check in the morning; and add more oil, as needed. I will aim at the 4th or top, 5th, diamond, COLD, using the side of the dipstick with the lowest reading. Sounds like I may end up higher than owner manual’s 5.1 qt (w/ filter) capacity ( I am already at 5.1qt).
Specifications section of manual states:
5.1 qt including filter
4.8 qt without filter
Total 5.9 qt (this must be the real max capacity?). Yet, the “changing the oil and filter” section of the manul states “engine oil change capacity, 5.1 qt.” I read folks on S2k that always top at 5.5 Just caught myself overanalyzing this again….
Good information on the discrepancy between coolant and oil temp. Interesting: you mentioned that a cold reading will give about 1x above hot—this is consistent with my experience today: my hot reading was below my cold reading, albeit not a proper reading since I had not driven the car; however, some folks believe that a hot reading will always be higher due to oil expansion (I know, and now understand, this is not necessarily the case).
As a side note, I cannot imagine the “jiff lubes” of the world or Honda Dealesrs caring for any of this. Sounds like they would just pour the oil per the manufacture’s recommendation (here 5.1qst), check, and that’s it. I have a fumoto valve and waited at least 1.5 to 2 hours before closing the valve.
Thanks again for all the advice.

xviper

The quantities indicated in the manual is not always what most people will put in after an oil change. Some will put in as much as 6 qts. It also depends on whether a person does a hot or cold drain and how long a drain is given.
Certainly, hot oil expands but this may be insignificant if the oil is not allowed to drain back down into the pan after the last engine run. If you fire up the engine as in right after an oil change to circulate the oil around and to fill the filter, then shut it off when the oil is still cold, the cool oil that hangs up in the motor will take a long time to come back down. This, compared to the few minutes for hot oil to fall back down when doing a hot check. Yet, even more oil will fall back down if left overnight. Folly is an oil level check when the oil is cold or cool immediately after engine shut down, when oil is splashed all over engine internals. Cool oil is more viscous than hot oil. IE, it sticks more and flows less well.

leoxle

Thanks for all the info. One question: My car got a recent oil change and my friend wanted to do it for me while I was busy(I trust him, he knows what he's doing) except he only put in about 4.8-5 qtz of oil, when our cars take up to 5.1, right? So now, when I check the dipstick, it looks like nothing is on it, just barely and its really clear. I haven't done the proper long way, but shouldn't you at least be able to see some on there? Is it because there isn't enough oil?

JonnydaJibba

This is a fantastic thread. My 2.5rs would always give me such all over the place readings when doing a hot check. I eventually started checking cold just because I was getting consistent readings. Now I know why. Thanks for the great information viper.

Car Analogy

Xvipers first post in this thread, whefe he gives the info for checking hot vs cold, is from 10 YEARS AGO. But I'm sure he appreciates the thanks nonetheless.