Misfire Mishaps
10-07-2010, 03:31 PM
#1
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Misfire Mishaps
This is not a dealer complaint thread, I'm merely trying to figure out if they're being honest with me.
9/26: Car throws CEL and VSA warning light comes on after driving for a few minutes.
9/29: Honda dealer diagnoses CEL as a misfire in cylinder 1, make appointment to come back on Sat (10/01) to let them have it for the day.
10/01: Dropped the car off Friday night and they have it for the day. No call by 12:30 (said they'd call by 10) so I call. They tell me that they don't know what's causing the misfire and have to call something called TechLine? to have them help with conducting more tests. Techline is only open M-F so I have to leave the car there over the weekend.
10/04: No call by 12 so I call them, they've run more tests with no results yet, running 1 more when I called and should know within 20-30 minutes. No call back for 3 hours so I call them. They figured out it's a bad fuel injector. Ordered one and it'll be in the next day, car will be ready in the afternoon.
10/05: No call by 3:30 or so, so I call again. They installed the new injector and went out to test and it started misfiring in other cylinders so they called TechLine again to see what they should do next. They're going to run a leakdown and compression test and see what the results are. Won't hear back from them till morning.
10/06: No call again by 3-ish, so I call them. They tell me they found out it has 2 bent valves and have taken the head off the motor and sent it to the machine shop for repairs. Tell me they should have it all done by Friday (10/08). I ask for a loaner car and they tell me they're all out but will call me and let me know since they should be getting some back. Never got a call.
10/07: No call by 3:30 so I call yet again. They have a loaner car for me (hurray, but why don't they ever call?) but I ask when the car will be done tomorrow because it might not be worth the hassle to get over there if I'm only going to have the car for the night. He just says "OH, your car won't be ready tomorrow...yeah it's going to at least be next Friday". Que a WTF from me and he tells me that since it's an s2000 head, it takes longer (uhh what, why?).
So here I am wondering if a misfire in a single cylinder could 1. be a bad injector (this seems logical to me) and 2. could bend 2 valves but cause no other damage in the motor? Or is there something more going on here?
If this is in the wrong forum, please move it.
9/26: Car throws CEL and VSA warning light comes on after driving for a few minutes.
9/29: Honda dealer diagnoses CEL as a misfire in cylinder 1, make appointment to come back on Sat (10/01) to let them have it for the day.
10/01: Dropped the car off Friday night and they have it for the day. No call by 12:30 (said they'd call by 10) so I call. They tell me that they don't know what's causing the misfire and have to call something called TechLine? to have them help with conducting more tests. Techline is only open M-F so I have to leave the car there over the weekend.
10/04: No call by 12 so I call them, they've run more tests with no results yet, running 1 more when I called and should know within 20-30 minutes. No call back for 3 hours so I call them. They figured out it's a bad fuel injector. Ordered one and it'll be in the next day, car will be ready in the afternoon.
10/05: No call by 3:30 or so, so I call again. They installed the new injector and went out to test and it started misfiring in other cylinders so they called TechLine again to see what they should do next. They're going to run a leakdown and compression test and see what the results are. Won't hear back from them till morning.
10/06: No call again by 3-ish, so I call them. They tell me they found out it has 2 bent valves and have taken the head off the motor and sent it to the machine shop for repairs. Tell me they should have it all done by Friday (10/08). I ask for a loaner car and they tell me they're all out but will call me and let me know since they should be getting some back. Never got a call.
10/07: No call by 3:30 so I call yet again. They have a loaner car for me (hurray, but why don't they ever call?) but I ask when the car will be done tomorrow because it might not be worth the hassle to get over there if I'm only going to have the car for the night. He just says "OH, your car won't be ready tomorrow...yeah it's going to at least be next Friday". Que a WTF from me and he tells me that since it's an s2000 head, it takes longer (uhh what, why?).
So here I am wondering if a misfire in a single cylinder could 1. be a bad injector (this seems logical to me) and 2. could bend 2 valves but cause no other damage in the motor? Or is there something more going on here?
If this is in the wrong forum, please move it.
10-07-2010, 03:42 PM
#2
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did you ever over-rev the car? it could very well be bent valves.
How much do you trust the dealer? maybe they messed with it and bent cylinders/overreved (lot tech?)
anyway, I'd go check up on your car...tell em you need to grab something from the car or whatever and check the mileage/inside/outside whiel youre at it
How much do you trust the dealer? maybe they messed with it and bent cylinders/overreved (lot tech?)
anyway, I'd go check up on your car...tell em you need to grab something from the car or whatever and check the mileage/inside/outside whiel youre at it
10-07-2010, 04:09 PM
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From my experience the dealers love to claim over-rev. I just have my head rebuilt by a local dealership, SOB's charged me $3,500 to replace all 16 valves.. Of course they said i over-revved the engine, which I never did. My belief is the TCT went and the timing skipped.
I dropped my car off on a Wednesday and had the car on Tuesday. So almost a week to have it done.
As an FYI, when they do a valve job, they only replace the valves and nothing else. Demand that they replace the retainers, springs, etc, and not charge you labor because they are already removing them and putting them back in.
I dropped my car off on a Wednesday and had the car on Tuesday. So almost a week to have it done.
As an FYI, when they do a valve job, they only replace the valves and nothing else. Demand that they replace the retainers, springs, etc, and not charge you labor because they are already removing them and putting them back in.
10-07-2010, 04:37 PM
#4
what sounds odd is that they would remove the head and send it to a machine shop without talking to you first. Very , very , strange.
Now if this is under warranty they wouldn't normally fix bent valves without theatening to blame you for the damage, again, very , very , strange.
Now if this is under warranty they wouldn't normally fix bent valves without theatening to blame you for the damage, again, very , very , strange.
10-08-2010, 01:48 AM
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Sounds like you've got a bad service adviser because he's not keeping you in the loop, however they could just be really busy. Also it sounds like you may have a new tech working on your vehicle because techline should be what you do when you've run out of ideas, it shouldn't be the second or third thing you do. Misfires aren't that hard...usually.
Warranty or not, they should have talked to you before they removed the head (unles you authorized a ton of money to be spent).
I used to be a honda tech but now i just cut pedals
Warranty or not, they should have talked to you before they removed the head (unles you authorized a ton of money to be spent).
I used to be a honda tech but now i just cut pedals
10-08-2010, 03:50 AM
#6
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Techline? gimme a f!@#ing break. That is for hole in the wall shops that no nothing about how a car works or how to fix it.
Your dealer has absolutely no clue what they are doing (neither does techline, they should have called a comp test first). After simple fuel and spark tests, the should have checked the compression right off the bat.
The injector was a complete guess. Make sure you dont pay for it.
Tell them you want the bent valves back from the machine shop. I'd also ask who the machine shop is and go talk to them personally.
Completely pathetic. I could diagnose a misfire while you wait in 5-15 minutes.
And bent valves on an AP2??? I think not. Unless you went from 3rd to FIRST while wide open. AP2 cannot suffer a single gear over-rev like the AP1.
Your dealer has absolutely no clue what they are doing (neither does techline, they should have called a comp test first). After simple fuel and spark tests, the should have checked the compression right off the bat.
The injector was a complete guess. Make sure you dont pay for it.
Tell them you want the bent valves back from the machine shop. I'd also ask who the machine shop is and go talk to them personally.
Completely pathetic. I could diagnose a misfire while you wait in 5-15 minutes.
And bent valves on an AP2??? I think not. Unless you went from 3rd to FIRST while wide open. AP2 cannot suffer a single gear over-rev like the AP1.
10-08-2010, 04:01 AM
#7
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Thread Starter
Originally Posted by Billman250,Oct 8 2010, 03:50 AM
Techline? gimme a f!@#ing break. That is for hole in the wall shops that no nothing about how a car works or how to fix it.
Your dealer has absolutely no clue what they are doing (neither does techline, they should have called a comp test first). After simple fuel and spark tests, the should have checked the compression right off the bat.
The injector was a complete guess. Make sure you dont pay for it.
Tell them you want the bent valves back from the machine shop. I'd also ask who the machine shop is and go talk to them personally.
Completely pathetic. I could diagnose a misfire while you wait in 5-15 minutes.
And bent valves on an AP2??? I think not. Unless you went from 3rd to FIRST while wide open. AP2 cannot suffer a single gear over-rev like the AP1.
Your dealer has absolutely no clue what they are doing (neither does techline, they should have called a comp test first). After simple fuel and spark tests, the should have checked the compression right off the bat.
The injector was a complete guess. Make sure you dont pay for it.
Tell them you want the bent valves back from the machine shop. I'd also ask who the machine shop is and go talk to them personally.
Completely pathetic. I could diagnose a misfire while you wait in 5-15 minutes.
And bent valves on an AP2??? I think not. Unless you went from 3rd to FIRST while wide open. AP2 cannot suffer a single gear over-rev like the AP1.
I appreciate the information guys, I'm going to have a talk with them when I'm there today (assuming they actually call me to come and pick me up, if they don't then they're getting a much angrier phone call).
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10-08-2010, 04:08 AM
#8
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Ask them why they waited 10 days to do a compression check. I wouldnt have waited 10 minutes.
Ask them why they need a tech line to tell them to do a compression test.
Ask them when they read the fuel trim, did the engine have a rich or lean condition. This is step 2 to chasing down a misfire. I'm sure they will say "fuel what?"
Ask them why it takes longer. s2k head does not take longer. Parts are readily available, just like a civic or accord.
No procedures vary. Nothing is different about the s2k head when it comes to machine shop service.
Ask them why they need a tech line to tell them to do a compression test.
Ask them when they read the fuel trim, did the engine have a rich or lean condition. This is step 2 to chasing down a misfire. I'm sure they will say "fuel what?"
Ask them why it takes longer. s2k head does not take longer. Parts are readily available, just like a civic or accord.
No procedures vary. Nothing is different about the s2k head when it comes to machine shop service.
10-08-2010, 06:48 AM
#10
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Thread Starter
@Billman: Thanks for all the help. I'm fairly non stupid when it comes to cars but don't really know too much about the intricate workings inside the motor. I'll be sure to ask them this stuff when I'm over there today.
@ljsimp: The car is at AutoPark Honda in Cary.
They called me @ 10:30 (an hour later than they were supposed to) to say they could come pick me up. I have a meeting here at work at 11 so I can't go now. Told them they'd have to wait and get me after. Then my service manager made some really odd, vaguely threatening statement about how my extended warranty doesn't cover rental cars. I'm not getting a rental, but a loaner from the dealer and was made aware of the lack of rental coverage when he tried to get me one when all the loaners were out earlier this week. I don't know why he brought it up at all, unless to say "we don't have to do this, so don't make trouble" or something...
They're going to be by between 2-2:30 to take me to the dealer and I plan on asking them a few questions while I'm there.
@ljsimp: The car is at AutoPark Honda in Cary.
They called me @ 10:30 (an hour later than they were supposed to) to say they could come pick me up. I have a meeting here at work at 11 so I can't go now. Told them they'd have to wait and get me after. Then my service manager made some really odd, vaguely threatening statement about how my extended warranty doesn't cover rental cars. I'm not getting a rental, but a loaner from the dealer and was made aware of the lack of rental coverage when he tried to get me one when all the loaners were out earlier this week. I don't know why he brought it up at all, unless to say "we don't have to do this, so don't make trouble" or something...
They're going to be by between 2-2:30 to take me to the dealer and I plan on asking them a few questions while I'm there.