zeroptzero

As you may know engine oil manufacturers have lowered additive levels in recent times to meet new standards aimed at extending the life of cat. converters.

If anyone is concerned about today's low SAP engine oils, there is one way to improve things IMO. Zinc and Phosphorous anti-wear additives are being lowered in today's over the counter oils, and even some boutique oils , in order to meet API standards. These two additives are prominent anti-wear additives within the industry. I personally don't like the idea of lowering these two key additives too much. Redline offers a good solution here:

http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=121&pcid=1

A mere 4 ounces will boost your engine oil back up to previous zinc and phosphorous levels previously used within the industry. Redline states that one bottle will treat 12 quarts but that boosts levels pretty high up (more for racing purposes). I'd cut it back to 4 ounces for every 5 quarts for street use, thus a 16 ounce bottle will do about 4 oil changes at 20 quarts. That's only about three bucks per oil change of added cost. This gives a decent boost without going too high, just to get levels back to where they used to be. Redline lists the bump-up in additive levels based on the amount you mix with your sump capaciity. I like they way the give you accurate measurements for additive boost levels. I don't quite need as much as they list, thus I'm using 4 ounces for every 5 quarts (25% of the bottle for each fill).

I'll be adding mine tonight. Hope to do a used oil analysis in a few months. This isn't anything harmful, it just replenishes additives to levels that were used in previous oil formulations, it is the same stuff that is currently in your engine oil, just at higher concentrations. I don't see any harm in the product, and it will still keep emmissions equipment safe at these levels. If you have a real oil burner then you may want to avoid this, but for healthy engines it should be good great.

Note: If you aren't into oil additives then this product recommendation is not for you. Using the oil formulations found in over the counter oils is just fine, you won't harm your engine by using today's oils by any stretch of the imagination. But if you want to protect things just a bit better than what is available in the marketplace then this ain't a bad way to go. This isn't a "snake oil" product, it's comprised of well known everyday oil additives from a top nothc company that is well respected in the oil formulation business.

SpitfireS

JFUSION Posted on Nov 25 2009, 11:09 PM
This sounds like "they" lowered harmfull-to-cat additive levels and stopped.
Don't you think "they" do a lot of R&D to replace the old fashioned anti-wear additives with modern ones?

You also kinda claim: "What I do is right and if you don't do it also.. well.. then that's your loss"
Do you know the additive package of you oil you use now?
(No you don't as not one oil manufacturer will tell you )
What makes you think the current package is inadequate?

Also, last time I checked the F20/F22's don't have flat tapped cam followers.
"We" have ball bearing rollers.

Higher levels of ZDDP and such would never have much use in the F20/F22.

Why not get Redline oil if you want ZDDP and call it a day?
Or even better: just drive the car and be happy and stop the shady tree alchemy

starchland

I immediately thought of zddp and that whole fiasco with it being bad for the cats when I read this.

Well many engines went on to live long and healthy lives after the removal of that from engine oils. I think it is safe to say that if you continue any sort of OCI with any shite oil and monitor oil level which is so crucial in these cars, you will be fine. Besides, most of us dont keep the car long enough anyway to see benefit from improving service life that any of these products may give.

zeroptzero

Ouch, you're being unecessarily harsh based on your misinterpretation of my post.
well no I didn't kinda claim anything. Nothing in the post states that I'm right about anything or others are wrong. If you want to change the intent of my post then write a new one yourself. Or you can re-read the post and highlight the areas if you still feel that way.

If you want to find out the composition of an oil the information is out there to be found. In many cases old additives have been replaced by new additives, but that's not always the case with every oil formula. Some manufacturers have just reduced the zinc and phos. and not made any other changes as they obviously felt it was fine to do so.

I'm well aware of the valvetrain design on this car. There's still plenty of high revving parts to protect on the engine, zinc and Phos. benefits aren't limited to flat tappets.

Shadetree alchemy is everywhere from upper cylinder lubes, fuel injector cleaners even nitrogen in your tires, why not oil too. No harm in running something, testing it out and seeing if it helps or not. If it does that is good, if it doesn't your out a few bucks at worst. I'll try it and see how it goes over a few UOA's.

I like my oil brand, I just wish that they didn't drop the additive levels, I don't really want to run Redline's oils at this time.

Lastly the post isn't about an engine being harmed by current oils, as I clearly stated in my post. Maybe I want to keep the car for another 10 years (my son will be driving in 8 more years or so). It's not my daily driver so I won't be changing it every 3 years like I do my other vehicles. The S2000 isn't disposable junk like most of the vehicles being built these days.

RedY2KS2k

I'm a bit confused:

"As you may know engine oil manufacturers have lowered additive levels in recent times to meet new standards aimed at extending the life of cat. converters.
...
This isn't anything harmful, it just replenishes additives to levels that were used in previous oil formulations, it is the same stuff that is currently in your engine oil, just at higher concentrations. I don't see any harm in the product, and it will still keep emissions equipment safe at these levels..."

They lowered the concentration of these additives to reduce premature failures of the catalytic converter, but raising those concentrations back up to their former level will keep emissions equipment safe?

starchland

I wouldnt call the s2000 disposable as some of us will try to keep it in the collection for many years to come

what oil are you using?

IcebergS2000

For those who don't read over on BITOG.

The Corvette Action Center's comprehensive look at engine oil and flat-tappet camshaft durability

zeroptzero

oh damn my bad, that was a big typo, I just corrected my reply. I meant to say that the S2000 "isn't" disposable junk like many of the cars being built right now. It's a great example of well crafted machines, where the individual parts are given lots of engineering time. This car is a garage queen/ hobby car for me, so I want to try and preserve it for a long time as I'm not putting many miles on it.

I am running Amsoil AFL, 5w-40. They changed the formula from the previous version by reducing the additive levels, and reducing the long drain recommendation. The car runs great on this oil, so I prefer to keep using it, the viscosity spec is pretty nice for what I want ( a thinner 40 weight), if I can just bump the additives a small amount I'll be happy (I'm talking 300-400 ppm bump). I'll test it down the road and see if it makes any difference, if not I'll just keep running the Amsoil the way it is. no biggie.

That Corvette link is mainly concerned with flat tappet engine issues like Spitfires referred to, but I still think it has some relevance to other high strung engines even though flat tappets aren't involved. Good readiing nonetheless. enjoy.

SpitfireS

JFUSION Posted on Nov 26 2009, 09:21 PM
Relax, the post has , and .
How is that harsh?


JFUSION Posted on Nov 25 2009, 11:09 PM
[QUOTE]If anyone is concerned about today's low SAP engine oils.....

zeroptzero

Spits, please excuse my crabbiness in this post. The intent of my original post was to describe the use of the Redline product on my car, rather than preaching to others about using it.

What I like about the Redline product is that they give you the additive boost levels based on sump capacity. The information on their website is very good, I agree that the bottle directions are not as informative. I also think that a 1/2 bottle boost rate might be a bit too much, thus I'm going with a 4 oz treat level to give me about 300-400 ppm boost. I think that is mild enough to get my preferred oil (Amsoil AFL) back to their previous formula's additive levels. This is a blind experiment, ff it doesn't show any decent results after some UOA's then I'll be the first one to admit it. I'm confident that it won't harm anything and the added cost (about $3.00 per OCI) is peanuts. I wish I could have some info sooner, rather than later but I just don't drive it that much.