View Poll Results: Engine vs Rotor Braking
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Engine vs Rotor Braking
09-22-2002, 05:42 AM
#81
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Originally posted by S2K2GO!!!
Bieg- I think you are confusing driving for brute-force performance(where your comments are more relevant) and driving with finesse(which is generally what I strive for). I have a passion for well-engineered vehicles like the S2K, and want to make it sing when I drive it. I certainly have no problem with compromised control. I also take pride in minimizing wear and tear on my car when I drive it, and I think those who really understand the capabilities designed into this car will understand that the driving style that I have described fits it well.
Bieg- I think you are confusing driving for brute-force performance(where your comments are more relevant) and driving with finesse(which is generally what I strive for). I have a passion for well-engineered vehicles like the S2K, and want to make it sing when I drive it. I certainly have no problem with compromised control. I also take pride in minimizing wear and tear on my car when I drive it, and I think those who really understand the capabilities designed into this car will understand that the driving style that I have described fits it well.
If you took pride in minimizing wear and tear on your car you would not be using your drivetrain instead of your brakes. Brute force is not the key element in performance driving (although you are trying to maximize acceleration, cornering and braking). Anyone that has driven fast and well KNOWS smoothness and correct technique are the key elements. Your technique is not correct (although it may be fun and give you enjoyment by doing it). I really don't care how you drive just don't tout it as being correct technique because it is not.
09-22-2002, 09:01 PM
#84
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by djohnston
[B]
.......HOWEVER, in street driving, downshifting for the purpose of engine braking and/or rev matching is a delight. Also as some have so correctly pointed out, it keeps the car in the proper gear for a given speed so that one can easily and quickly accelerate out of a possible dangerous situation (large truck bearing down on you from behind). Even for those who ardently believe it's bad for their car, not having your car in the proper gear at all times (whether accelerating or decelerating) is simply unsafe. ........
No kidding- few things are more unpleasant than needing power in the S2k, flooring it, and realizing you've only got 3K RPM under the hood. This car reminds me very much of my 1969 Alpha Romeo Spyder Veloce, a bit high strung but a sheer delight to drive if you just kept it singing. The S2K is very happy to spend all of its time within a couple thousand of peak torque, and I feel that it is designed to be able to do so all day without harm. In that range, there is very little need of braking in most street situations.
[B]
.......HOWEVER, in street driving, downshifting for the purpose of engine braking and/or rev matching is a delight. Also as some have so correctly pointed out, it keeps the car in the proper gear for a given speed so that one can easily and quickly accelerate out of a possible dangerous situation (large truck bearing down on you from behind). Even for those who ardently believe it's bad for their car, not having your car in the proper gear at all times (whether accelerating or decelerating) is simply unsafe. ........
No kidding- few things are more unpleasant than needing power in the S2k, flooring it, and realizing you've only got 3K RPM under the hood. This car reminds me very much of my 1969 Alpha Romeo Spyder Veloce, a bit high strung but a sheer delight to drive if you just kept it singing. The S2K is very happy to spend all of its time within a couple thousand of peak torque, and I feel that it is designed to be able to do so all day without harm. In that range, there is very little need of braking in most street situations.
09-23-2002, 10:55 PM
#85
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I use engine braking quite a bit, especially on the track. But I don't over rev, and I don't lock up the rear tires. I practice doing it on the street all the time, like virtually every shift.
Example:
At Buttonwillow this weekend, I didn't hit the brakes for the Star Mazda turn until I came around the last left hander after the Esses(pretty close to flat out through the Esses, I may have lifted a teeny bit). The ONLY way I could get the car slowed down in time to make the turn is to:
1. Brake REALLY hard coming around the left hand turn
2. Heel-toe 4-3, match revs, release clutch (still braking, not over revving, not locking up rear tires)
3. Heel-toe, 3-2, match revs, release clutch (still braking, not over revving, not locking up rear tires, and turning wheel to trail brake into the turn)
If I just tried to use brakes only without downshifting, I would definitely overshoot the turn and go off into the dirt. Which means that without using a little "engine braking", I would have to hit the brakes BEFORE the left hander, and I would have to take my foot off the gas earlier. Taking foot off of gas, in general, is bad for laptimes.
Less Brake, More Gas,
-Doug
Don't brake+heel-toe-downshift until your brains says, "Oh Shit, we might not make it"
Example:
At Buttonwillow this weekend, I didn't hit the brakes for the Star Mazda turn until I came around the last left hander after the Esses(pretty close to flat out through the Esses, I may have lifted a teeny bit). The ONLY way I could get the car slowed down in time to make the turn is to:
1. Brake REALLY hard coming around the left hand turn
2. Heel-toe 4-3, match revs, release clutch (still braking, not over revving, not locking up rear tires)
3. Heel-toe, 3-2, match revs, release clutch (still braking, not over revving, not locking up rear tires, and turning wheel to trail brake into the turn)
If I just tried to use brakes only without downshifting, I would definitely overshoot the turn and go off into the dirt. Which means that without using a little "engine braking", I would have to hit the brakes BEFORE the left hander, and I would have to take my foot off the gas earlier. Taking foot off of gas, in general, is bad for laptimes.
Less Brake, More Gas,
-Doug
Don't brake+heel-toe-downshift until your brains says, "Oh Shit, we might not make it"
09-25-2002, 11:22 AM
#86
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If you were REALLY braking hard (threshold braking) the downshifts would have no effect on your ability to slow the car down. 100% of your stopping ability is achieved by your brakes. The only reason you should be heel toe downshifting is to be in the correct gear to roll on the throttle as soon as you can.
01-08-2003, 06:34 PM
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Everyone needs to relax. If you wanted to save money on clutches or bake pads, you would have bought a Chevy Malibu. Everyone on this board purchased a car that can't rotate tires!
I SAY: YOU HAVE A PERFORMANCE CAR, DRIVE IT LIKE A MAN(WOMAN).
I SAY: YOU HAVE A PERFORMANCE CAR, DRIVE IT LIKE A MAN(WOMAN).