Diff serviced today...
12-02-2007, 04:07 AM
#11
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[QUOTE=SpitfireS,Dec 2 2007, 05:39 AM] INDYMAC Posted on Dec 1 2007, 07:20 PM
LE-1605 (and the complete range) have been available since September 2007.
SAE changed their SAE J306 gear oil spec in 2005.
Changed = added SAE 110 in between SAE 90 and SAE 140 to allow a better grade definition of the SAE 90 oil.
SAE quote: [I]there were factions within SAE that felt the wide range could result in an axle being serviced with a lubricant that had a viscosity significantly lower or higher than the axle lubricant that the axle had been designed to operate with, even though the
LE-1605 (and the complete range) have been available since September 2007.
SAE changed their SAE J306 gear oil spec in 2005.
Changed = added SAE 110 in between SAE 90 and SAE 140 to allow a better grade definition of the SAE 90 oil.
SAE quote: [I]there were factions within SAE that felt the wide range could result in an axle being serviced with a lubricant that had a viscosity significantly lower or higher than the axle lubricant that the axle had been designed to operate with, even though the
12-02-2007, 02:37 PM
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Sideways Posted on Dec 2 2007, 04:57 PM
The only thing they (Honda) took is the 7" ring and pinion.
Whoever makes the gears.
And I found one post on Miata.net about the factory recommendation being SAE 90 for the diff.
Nevertheless I think its true.
Is it possble to scan that page?
I hope so, because ... our S2000 has "a little" more HP then the 1.6, 1.8 and 2.0 Miata / MX5 engines even in 2007 trim.
So going down in diff oil spec is IMO not a good idea.
INDYMAC Posted on Dec 2 2007, 03:07 PM
IMO it is.
If a lable on a bottle states is a certain kind of oil I want that to be in the bottle I buy
The old & empty bottle in front of me has the ISO VG 220 / SAE 90 / AGMA 5EP on it.
Batch # 17704
I hope the 104.7 / 20.96 oil is in my diff.
I'm glad you did 
Do you think there is anymore to Honda's recommendation other than pass through information from Mazda, the original supplier?
Whoever makes the gears.
And I found one post on Miata.net about the factory recommendation being SAE 90 for the diff.
Nevertheless I think its true.
Is it possble to scan that page?
Do you think Honda has looked at this subject at all?
So going down in diff oil spec is IMO not a good idea.
INDYMAC Posted on Dec 2 2007, 03:07 PM
I never had a bottle of the original 104.7 SUS formula, so I can't confirm whether the label changed. I don't think it is relavent though.
If a lable on a bottle states is a certain kind of oil I want that to be in the bottle I buy
The old & empty bottle in front of me has the ISO VG 220 / SAE 90 / AGMA 5EP on it.
Batch # 17704
I hope the 104.7 / 20.96 oil is in my diff.
In fact, since LE 607 is discontinued, I didn't plan to offer this information at all.
12-03-2007, 02:28 AM
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Originally Posted by SpitfireS,Dec 3 2007, 01:41 AM
My grandfather lived to be 87, smoking 2 packs a day = smoking must be healthy.
A more correct statement would be that smoking was not terribly unhealthy to your grandfather. It could still be terribly unhealthy for everyone else.
To get back on topic, though...
I went with the Castrol 75w-90 synthetic for another reason, as well; I'd seen a remark on it's use in another thread, but without 'the sky is falling' type remarks to disuade anyone from using it. To caveat the above remark, though;
IF:
1) some owners are using a multigrade synthetic and not experiencing differential problems
AND
2)Nobody that has used the multigrade synthetic or a similar-quality product has experienced a diff failure directly attributable to the multigrade lubricant
THEN
The 75W90 synthetic must provide the same or better cooling, cleaning, lubricating, and protective qualities as the OEM-specified GL5 Hypoid 90W.
A logic statement like this must be tested. Of course there would be only one way to absolutely confirm it to be true, as well there must be certain conditions met to prove it false. In the middle, however, I'll paraphrase 'Mythbusters' and say that it could be 'plausible' if it can neither be absolutely proven nor absolutely disproven.
We already know that some are indeed using multi-grade synthetics, and if they aren't hollering that their diff has been ruined, then we can assume that (1), above, is true.
To prove (2) is difficult, but if anyone HAS had a diff failure attributable to using a multi-grade synthetic, and NOT also due to use off-road, then please post. I specify not off-road because you can't reasonably expect that any OEM part will not fail, even when serviced exactly as the OEM specified, when used for hard duty (HPDE, lapping days, time attack, etc.)
This should be fun...
12-03-2007, 06:41 AM
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@ S2Nice:
You're trying to defend your choice by saying "Its innocent until proven guilty"
Did you not see the UOA of the Redline 75W-90 in INDYMAC's post?
Eventhough it didn't shear down it produced high wear numbers.
It was tested at SUS 83.7
Redline specs it in cSt, at 16.4 cSt @ 100C
To convert (GOOGLE) : if SUS >32 and < 100 then cSt = 0.226SUS - 195/SUS.
This gives 83.7 SUS = 16.6 cST.
No shearning.
High wear.
The LE, even if it did shear down from 105 to 93, produced low wear levels.
Okay, this is just one example, it would have been a lot better if there were more.
But I say, guilty based on the one fingerprint on the murder weapon.
Again, its your diff.
Put in it what you want.
Your owners manual suggests otherwise.
Let me drag the other oil debate in here, just to make one point.
Q - What engine oil do you use?
A - 10W-30
Q - Why?
A - Because its written on the filler cap, and engine manufacturer knows best .. right?
Q - What diff oil do you use?
A - 75W-90
Q - Why?
A - Well.. it's all I could find and I've been reading on some internet forum
that people say its ok to use but I never bothered to read that part of my manaul.
You're trying to defend your choice by saying "Its innocent until proven guilty"
Did you not see the UOA of the Redline 75W-90 in INDYMAC's
post?Eventhough it didn't shear down it produced high wear numbers.
It was tested at SUS 83.7
Redline specs it in cSt, at 16.4 cSt @ 100C
To convert (GOOGLE) : if SUS >32 and < 100 then cSt = 0.226SUS - 195/SUS.
This gives 83.7 SUS = 16.6 cST.
No shearning.
High wear.
The LE, even if it did shear down from 105 to 93, produced low wear levels.
Okay, this is just one example, it would have been a lot better if there were more.
But I say, guilty based on the one fingerprint on the murder weapon.
Again, its your diff.
Put in it what you want.
Your owners manual suggests otherwise.
Let me drag the other oil debate in here, just to make one point.
Q - What engine oil do you use?
A - 10W-30
Q - Why?
A - Because its written on the filler cap, and engine manufacturer knows best .. right?
Q - What diff oil do you use?
A - 75W-90
Q - Why?
A - Well.. it's all I could find and I've been reading on some internet forum
that people say its ok to use but I never bothered to read that part of my manaul.
12-03-2007, 10:33 AM
#20
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Originally Posted by S2Nice,Dec 3 2007, 03:28 AM
You are almost correct!
A more correct statement would be that smoking was not terribly unhealthy to your grandfather. It could still be terribly unhealthy for everyone else.
To get back on topic, though...
I went with the Castrol 75w-90 synthetic for another reason, as well; I'd seen a remark on it's use in another thread, but without 'the sky is falling' type remarks to disuade anyone from using it. To caveat the above remark, though;
IF:
1) some owners are using a multigrade synthetic and not experiencing differential problems
AND
2)Nobody that has used the multigrade synthetic or a similar-quality product has experienced a diff failure directly attributable to the multigrade lubricant
THEN
The 75W90 synthetic must provide the same or better cooling, cleaning, lubricating, and protective qualities as the OEM-specified GL5 Hypoid 90W.
A logic statement like this must be tested. Of course there would be only one way to absolutely confirm it to be true, as well there must be certain conditions met to prove it false. In the middle, however, I'll paraphrase 'Mythbusters' and say that it could be 'plausible' if it can neither be absolutely proven nor absolutely disproven.
We already know that some are indeed using multi-grade synthetics, and if they aren't hollering that their diff has been ruined, then we can assume that (1), above, is true.
To prove (2) is difficult, but if anyone HAS had a diff failure attributable to using a multi-grade synthetic, and NOT also due to use off-road, then please post. I specify not off-road because you can't reasonably expect that any OEM part will not fail, even when serviced exactly as the OEM specified, when used for hard duty (HPDE, lapping days, time attack, etc.)
This should be fun...
A more correct statement would be that smoking was not terribly unhealthy to your grandfather. It could still be terribly unhealthy for everyone else.
To get back on topic, though...
I went with the Castrol 75w-90 synthetic for another reason, as well; I'd seen a remark on it's use in another thread, but without 'the sky is falling' type remarks to disuade anyone from using it. To caveat the above remark, though;
IF:
1) some owners are using a multigrade synthetic and not experiencing differential problems
AND
2)Nobody that has used the multigrade synthetic or a similar-quality product has experienced a diff failure directly attributable to the multigrade lubricant
THEN
The 75W90 synthetic must provide the same or better cooling, cleaning, lubricating, and protective qualities as the OEM-specified GL5 Hypoid 90W.
A logic statement like this must be tested. Of course there would be only one way to absolutely confirm it to be true, as well there must be certain conditions met to prove it false. In the middle, however, I'll paraphrase 'Mythbusters' and say that it could be 'plausible' if it can neither be absolutely proven nor absolutely disproven.
We already know that some are indeed using multi-grade synthetics, and if they aren't hollering that their diff has been ruined, then we can assume that (1), above, is true.
To prove (2) is difficult, but if anyone HAS had a diff failure attributable to using a multi-grade synthetic, and NOT also due to use off-road, then please post. I specify not off-road because you can't reasonably expect that any OEM part will not fail, even when serviced exactly as the OEM specified, when used for hard duty (HPDE, lapping days, time attack, etc.)
This should be fun...
For a occasional driver that doesn't drop the clutch at 6,000+ rpm or autocross/track daily. Castrol Synthetic 75w90 will do fine.
In fact at Canadian Tire, the choices are Shell Nautilus straight 90 dino, Castrol Synthetic 75w90
Both will do a good job for the majority of the s2000 drivers out there.
For the people that do drop the clutch on a daily basis and/or track heavily then investing in a 20.00+ a litre lubricant might help extend the life of your diff.
So far i've tried Amsoil, Motul (always a full syn), next might be the Castrol Syn at 9.00 a litre as oppose to 20.00 a litre for the motul