Diagnosing torsen failure
10-21-2007, 02:02 PM
#21
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Dry Branch
Posts: 7,087
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I Googled to see if I could come up with any references for myself. While most writeups seem to *imply* that the F2xC is the engine code, and APx is the chassis code. Only one of the hits addressed the issue directly.
If that ^^^ is correct, then F22C doesn't have anything to do with the AP2 chassis, other than having been introduced to the North American market in the same year.
However, the Wikipedia article doesn't site reliable references either, so who knows whether it's right or not. If you have something from Honda directly, or from some other more reliable source, please share. Let's get rid of the misconceptions, wherever they might be.
Originally Posted by http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_S2000
The 2004 model introduced newly designed 17" wheels and Bridgestone RE-050 tires along with a retuned suspension that reduced the car's tendency to oversteer. The spring rates and shock absorber damping were altered and the suspension geometry modified to improve stability by reducing toe-in changes under cornering loads. In addition, cosmetic changes were made to the exterior with new front and rear bumpers, revised headlight assemblies, new LED tail-lights, and oval-tipped exhausts. At the same time, Honda introduced a 2.2 L variant to the North American market. The revised car was given the chassis designation AP2.
However, the Wikipedia article doesn't site reliable references either, so who knows whether it's right or not. If you have something from Honda directly, or from some other more reliable source, please share. Let's get rid of the misconceptions, wherever they might be.
10-21-2007, 06:58 PM
#22
Originally Posted by RED MX5,Oct 21 2007, 10:43 AM
I suspect Billman will be as surprised as I am by that information.
Can you cite a reliable reference so this can be verified?
Can you cite a reliable reference so this can be verified?
10-22-2007, 05:44 AM
#23
Registered User
dunno about JDM, but since they retained F20 as well, then i guess they (along with EUDM) are running AP1
below is my car-badge-plate-thingy that i posted about 20 times already To be precise, VIN is JHMAP113xxxxxxx
below is my car-badge-plate-thingy that i posted about 20 times already
To be precise, VIN is JHMAP113xxxxxxx
10-22-2007, 08:11 AM
#24
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Dry Branch
Posts: 7,087
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Agent, thanks for taking the time to take and post the picture. 
Does your '06 AP1 have the same rear subframe, steering rack, and other changes that we saw here in the USA with the AP2, or is it the same as my early (MY00) US Spec AP1?
Once we're sure we have this sorted out, one of you guys should edit the Wikipedia information. Point to this thread and Agent's picture as a reference.
Does your '06 AP1 have the same rear subframe, steering rack, and other changes that we saw here in the USA with the AP2, or is it the same as my early (MY00) US Spec AP1?
Once we're sure we have this sorted out, one of you guys should edit the Wikipedia information. Point to this thread and Agent's picture as a reference.
10-22-2007, 08:56 AM
#25
Registered User
Originally Posted by RED MX5,Oct 22 2007, 07:11 PM
Does your '06 AP1 have the same rear subframe, steering rack, and other changes that we saw here in the USA with the AP2, or is it the same as my early (MY00) US Spec AP1?
I figured that except the body style, DBW and suspension setup everything is the same as in AP1...
i compared MY00 EUDM vs MY06 EUDM, and to tell you the truth, at least under the hood, they were pretty much identical, but i haven't digged any deeper than that
10-22-2007, 10:27 AM
#26
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Dry Branch
Posts: 7,087
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by agent,Oct 22 2007, 11:56 AM
i'm not quite sure.... if you'll post me picture of how does AP1 subframe, for instance, compare to AP2 - then i can check. or maybe there are some part numbers i can look up?
I figured that except the body style, DBW and suspension setup everything is the same as in AP1...
i compared MY00 EUDM vs MY06 EUDM, and to tell you the truth, at least under the hood, they were pretty much identical, but i haven't digged any deeper than that
I figured that except the body style, DBW and suspension setup everything is the same as in AP1...
i compared MY00 EUDM vs MY06 EUDM, and to tell you the truth, at least under the hood, they were pretty much identical, but i haven't digged any deeper than that
This is interesting, because for years, most of us have thought that the subframe and steering changes as a part of the AP2 package, and now it's looking like that was wrong.
Does your MY06 have a CDV or a heavier flywheel than your MY00 car had?
I wish Billman would chime in, becuae he can look up part numbers at work, and that would help.
NADM AP2's also got a different differential, synchros, clutch, and a lot of other stuff, that was billed as a part of the AP2 package. Does your '06 AP1 have all that, along with the F20Cx?
10-22-2007, 11:32 AM
#27
Registered User
Originally Posted by RED MX5,Oct 22 2007, 09:27 PM
I don't have part numbers handy, but I do know that cars for the North American market ("AP2's") got a new rear subframe, and that they got a steering rack with a slower steering ratio, so those would be good parts to check. Do you know if your MY00 EUDM car had the same steering ratio as your MY06? The AP2's also got 17" wheels, compared to the 16" wheels on the AP1's, and of course the tires are different too. Does your '06 have 17" wheels? If so, it probably also has the new subframe, steering rack, etc.
This is interesting, because for years, most of us have thought that the subframe and steering changes as a part of the AP2 package, and now it's looking like that was wrong.
Does your MY06 have a CDV or a heavier flywheel than your MY00 car had?
I wish Billman would chime in, becuae he can look up part numbers at work, and that would help.
NADM AP2's also got a different differential, synchros, clutch, and a lot of other stuff, that was billed as a part of the AP2 package. Does your '06 AP1 have all that, along with the F20Cx?
This is interesting, because for years, most of us have thought that the subframe and steering changes as a part of the AP2 package, and now it's looking like that was wrong.
Does your MY06 have a CDV or a heavier flywheel than your MY00 car had?
I wish Billman would chime in, becuae he can look up part numbers at work, and that would help.
NADM AP2's also got a different differential, synchros, clutch, and a lot of other stuff, that was billed as a part of the AP2 package. Does your '06 AP1 have all that, along with the F20Cx?
CDV - present as well, at least i believe it is
i didn't drive that MY00. i just met a guy once and we only checked out each others cars for 15 min. or so. didn't go into technical details.
We definetly need pictures of the parts that changed or some hard part numbers to compare something solid. And i do have couple of pictures of MY06's underside.
http://www.lameg.ee/temp/P7280378.JPG http://www.lameg.ee/temp/P7280381.JPG
Actually this is starting to interest me a lot. I am planning to buy some upgrades and i 100% believed that if it says AP1 - then it is. But since some features on NADM AP2s are the same as MY06 EUDM AP1 - then it just very well might be that EU.AP1=NA.AP2, which means that my list of things to buy is completely wrong
10-22-2007, 02:15 PM
#28
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Dry Branch
Posts: 7,087
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
[QUOTE=agent,Oct 22 2007, 02:32 PM]like the FOTO shows - 17x7 215*45 Potenza RE050 in front and 17x8.5 245*40 Potenza RE050 in the back. so this is the same as AP2.
CDV - present as well, at least i believe it is
i didn't drive that MY00. i just met a guy once and we only checked out each others cars for 15 min. or so. didn't go into technical details.
We definetly need pictures of the parts that changed or some hard part numbers to compare something solid. And i do have couple of pictures of MY06's underside.
http://www.lameg.ee/temp/P7280378.JPG http://www.lameg.ee/temp/P7280381.JPG
Actually this is starting to interest me a lot. I am planning to buy some upgrades and i 100% believed that if it says AP1 - then it is. But since some features on NADM AP2s are the same as MY06 EUDM AP1 - then it just very well might be that EU.AP1=NA.AP2, which means that my list of things to buy is completely wrong
CDV - present as well, at least i believe it is
i didn't drive that MY00. i just met a guy once and we only checked out each others cars for 15 min. or so. didn't go into technical details.
We definetly need pictures of the parts that changed or some hard part numbers to compare something solid. And i do have couple of pictures of MY06's underside.
http://www.lameg.ee/temp/P7280378.JPG http://www.lameg.ee/temp/P7280381.JPG
Actually this is starting to interest me a lot. I am planning to buy some upgrades and i 100% believed that if it says AP1 - then it is. But since some features on NADM AP2s are the same as MY06 EUDM AP1 - then it just very well might be that EU.AP1=NA.AP2, which means that my list of things to buy is completely wrong
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post