Changed to Redline 5W-20 for my AP2
02-08-2010, 09:36 AM
#71
[QUOTE=gernby,Feb 8 2010, 09:04 AM] I wouldn't consider "losing a chunk of a piston" to be "engine wear".
02-08-2010, 09:58 AM
#72
My TL-S with the 3.5 289 hp engine runs Amsoil 5-20 per the manual and I supply the oil and filter for the changes. While this may not be the best cost saving way to change oil, the last change also found my battery failed the test so it was replaced by the dealer under warrenty.
I do use Amsoil 10-30 in my 05 S2000 but will watch for results of the UOA.
I do use Amsoil 10-30 in my 05 S2000 but will watch for results of the UOA.
02-08-2010, 10:38 AM
#74
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gernby Posted on Feb 8 2010, 06:04 PM
Ester oils are known to be very detergent.
(Auto-RX has an all ester base)
Its cleaning-up the insides of your engine.
What oil did you use before?
Maybe that oil wasn't as heat resistant / detergent as they made you think.
Some UOA's company's offer a particle count, not just usual the spectrum analysis.
They catch the parts just making it through the filter, those are the ones you have to really worrie about.
They are to big for the spectrum analysis.
You're using a 20 weight that is as thick as a generic dino 10W-30 after 3k miles.
But your 20 weight has a higher HTHS.
No worries.
pmptx Posted on Feb 8 2010, 08:04 PM
That's a no-brainer 
As in: yes do it!
SSO is great stuff.
I'm using it.
Even in the cold the engine is smooth right after a start.
You really have to watch the temp gauge, going by the noise its tempting to get into the higher revs too soon.
One thing I forgot to mention about the sample I took for the UOA is that it was surprisingly dark.
(Auto-RX has an all ester base)
Its cleaning-up the insides of your engine.
What oil did you use before?
Maybe that oil wasn't as heat resistant / detergent as they made you think.
Some UOA's company's offer a particle count, not just usual the spectrum analysis.
They catch the parts just making it through the filter, those are the ones you have to really worrie about.
They are to big for the spectrum analysis.
You're using a 20 weight that is as thick as a generic dino 10W-30 after 3k miles.
But your 20 weight has a higher HTHS.
No worries.
pmptx Posted on Feb 8 2010, 08:04 PM
was wondering about Amsoil 0W30 instead of 5w or 10w for the 2008 S2000?
As in: yes do it!
SSO is great stuff.
I'm using it.
Even in the cold the engine is smooth right after a start.
You really have to watch the temp gauge, going by the noise its tempting to get into the higher revs too soon.
02-08-2010, 10:46 AM
#75
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The oil that was in my car before I changed to RL 5W-20 was from the dealer. I assume it was probably a conventional 10W-30. However, I did send a sample of it for UOA also.
02-08-2010, 12:24 PM
#76
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Originally Posted by JFUSION,Feb 8 2010, 10:19 AM
The only thing that gets me about Honda's oil recommendations is that they never recommend 20 weights in their higher revving VTEC engines. Though they will recommend it in the lower peformance version of the same vehicle - RSX-S vs. RSX, Civic Si vs Civic, etc... . I figure they must know something that we don't.
If the S2000 was re-engineered and built today I still don't think Honda would recommend a 20 weight oil.
If the S2000 was re-engineered and built today I still don't think Honda would recommend a 20 weight oil.
the 20wt Redline oil being discussed is only just barely not a 30wt, and in some measures, it really is. but a typical dino 5w20 is not going to act that way.
this fits in with the inferred rationale for Honda recommending 5w40 for winter (rather than 5w30)... in 1999, the dino 5w30 oils were not as good as they are today. 10w30 was/is more shear stable. so, wanting to offer a thinner winter option, rather than specifiying only synthetic 5w30, they go with 5w40, knowing that it's only available as a synthetic.
02-08-2010, 12:28 PM
#77
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Originally Posted by philbert,Feb 8 2010, 05:24 PM
I think the issue is that a manufacturer must base the manual on the worst case scenario... if they spec an oil weight, they have to be confident that even the worst oil on the market that meets the specification is safe for the engine.
the 20wt Redline oil being discussed is only just barely not a 30wt, and in some measures, it really is. but a typical dino 5w20 is not going to act that way.
this fits in with the inferred rationale for Honda recommending 5w40 for winter (rather than 5w30)... in 1999, the dino 5w30 oils were not as good as they are today. 10w30 was/is more shear stable. so, wanting to offer a thinner winter option, rather than specifiying only synthetic 5w30, they go with 5w40, knowing that it's only available as a synthetic.
the 20wt Redline oil being discussed is only just barely not a 30wt, and in some measures, it really is. but a typical dino 5w20 is not going to act that way.
this fits in with the inferred rationale for Honda recommending 5w40 for winter (rather than 5w30)... in 1999, the dino 5w30 oils were not as good as they are today. 10w30 was/is more shear stable. so, wanting to offer a thinner winter option, rather than specifiying only synthetic 5w30, they go with 5w40, knowing that it's only available as a synthetic.
Also, I believe when you have a thinner oil, the oil pump will need to work harder, going too thin might have psi issues above X rpm's.
02-08-2010, 01:31 PM
#78
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Originally Posted by iDomN8U,Feb 8 2010, 03:28 PM
Bingo.
Also, I believe when you have a thinner oil, the oil pump will need to work harder, going too thin might have psi issues above X rpm's.
Also, I believe when you have a thinner oil, the oil pump will need to work harder, going too thin might have psi issues above X rpm's.
02-08-2010, 01:33 PM
#79
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iDomN8U Posted on Feb 8 2010, 10:28 PM
It's the opposite.
A thinner oil makes the pump work less hard.
Squeeze water out of a bottle, or sirup - which is harder?
Anyway.. its not psi you need, its flow.
The "internal" psi generated by the crank journals rotating is way much higher than any oil pump will create and the oil is partly sucked / partly pushed in by the pump.
Remember the oil jars you see on steam locomotives?
Only gravity to deliver oil.
The engine oil pump moves oil around.
With a pressure dependent relief, a positive displacement pump is going to deliver more thinner oil at higher rpm's.
Simple hydraulics.
Also, I believe when you have a thinner oil, the oil pump will need to work harder, going too thin might have psi issues above X rpm's.
A thinner oil makes the pump work less hard.
Squeeze water out of a bottle, or sirup - which is harder?
Anyway.. its not psi you need, its flow.
The "internal" psi generated by the crank journals rotating is way much higher than any oil pump will create and the oil is partly sucked / partly pushed in by the pump.
Remember the oil jars you see on steam locomotives?
Only gravity to deliver oil.
The engine oil pump moves oil around.
With a pressure dependent relief, a positive displacement pump is going to deliver more thinner oil at higher rpm's.
Simple hydraulics.
02-08-2010, 03:17 PM
#80
Honda pretty much breaks things down like this: Engines that rev to 8000 plus RPMs all spec 30 weight oils. Engines that rev below 8000 rpms can have recommended 20 weight oils.
What oil weights do Honda motorcycles run these days ?, I'm not up to date with the cycle end of things currently, but I know they use to run 40 weights in the past. It would be interesting to know as they rev extremely high.