aviator

hi guys. here is a quick background: i went in with "slightly" sticky/notchy first gear shifting when the engine is cold. the dealer replaced the master and slave cylinders (using extended warranty). when i got it back, it was worse!! now, when the engine is cold, i just can't shift into reverse or first gears!! here is the sequence that simulates and mitigates the issue: (it is MY2006, 45k miles, original clutch, no other problems)

- the problems appear when the car is dead-cold. once it is warmed up, the shifting is butter-smooth!
- the problems are with shifting into first gear and reverse.
- when the clutch is depressed and the shifter is shifted to first, it will not go into gear.
- it will feel like the clutch is not depressed and the gate is fully blocked.
- without taking the foot off the clutch (keep it pressed), bring the shifter back to neutral position and shift again into first. it will engage (it will be notchy).
- the second attempt (that is, second time into gear, without taking the foot off the clutch) will be better. and, subsequent attempts (again, without taking the foot off the clutch) will get smoother and smoother.
- likewise, when releasing into neutral, it will feel like the clutch wasn't fully pressed.
- the above cycle will be repeated once you take your foot off the clutch and tried to shift into first by depressing the clutch again. that is, every time the clutch is engaged (foot off) and disengaged (foot down), above problems will be repeated.

the tech at the dealership speculated that the bearing at the clutch pedal (forgot what he called it) becomes warmer each time the clutch pedal is pressed and makes it easier to engage the gear. he mentioned that the transmission needs to be opened up. i wasn't sure.

so, what is the likely cause?

thanks a lot.

cheers.
henry.

niick

The troll in me notices that if you can't get the shifter into 1st gear in the first place, how can it be subsequently easier each time after returning into neutral from first.. But I digress.

I had a notchy shifter for a while and I haven't addressed or fixed the problem, the trouble shooting advice I was given:

-adjust the clutch so that it has more throw and will move farther with a full depress
-ensure that the spindle isn't rusted, apply grease to it (spindle comes from factory ungreased and can be prone to rusting. you live in Minnesota, a common place for rust to occur with your salty roads right?)



I just adjusted my driving style to shift slower until the car is 100% warmed up and had the gears played through until I shift faster.


Also, I'm not sure if the ungreased spindle is an Ap1 only issue or not.


I guess worse case scenario you could bite the bullet and just roll backwards instead of using reverse and start in second gear

aviator

niick: thanks for the response. to reiterate, the problem is exactly as i have described. after posting, i saw a number of forum members reported on shifting issues when cold, though my issue might be unrelated.

yes, i do use this car for winter and rainy days. and, i am gonna sound ignorant here: what is spindle? and, how is it related to clutch pedal? if rusted, when the shifter is attempted again (without lifting the clutch pedal) how does it make it engage? by the same token, when the engine warms up, the shifting is smooth as butter!

i am leaning toward bleeding the clutch fluid and refill with Amsoil Brake Fluid DOT-3. that could be a non-intrusive way to isolate one variable.

thanks.

alphalanos

my 00 does almost exactly the same thing. when i first get in and start, it is either impossible or very hard to get 1 or R unless I shift through a couple other gears a few times. For example I can go 4-3 then try R and its usually a little easier. Then the more I shift when I first start driving it gets easier and easeir until eventally it feel 'normal' Im using Honda MTF I might switch to Amsoil next time , I hear its a little better when cold. I think its mostly the temperature.

s2k-tilldeath

Our cars are known to notchy on shifting when cold. For example MY02 is notchy going into 2nd gear when cold, and it's notchy going into 1st gear when cold UNLESS I'm going 0mph, then it's like butter. So when I drive when it's cold I shift out of first gear and with the clutch still pressed down I put it into 4th then into 2nd and it goes in like butter. My friend told me to try putting it into 3rd or 4th before I put it into 2nd with the clutch still pressed down, and to no avail it works perfect. I have to do that for about the first 5-10 minutes of driving until 2nd gear becomes smooth. Once the gears get warm with all that heat they start to expand a little bit which allows for easier shifting.

spets

I would consider having the transmission fluid changed if it has a lot of miles on it. while it may not cure everything, it may improve the notchiness. Certainly cheaper than tearing the transmission apart.

aviator

alphalanos:
you are right; it seems to be related to transmission/clutch/engine temperature. odd thing is, it was fine (aside from slight notchiness) until it went in master/slave cylinder replacement, for notchiness!! now, it is not notchy; just can't shift into!

s2k-tilldeath:
it sounds painful! i would hate to live with it. you got to fix it! again, my problem is not notchiness; just can't shift into until warmed up. i am not sure all S2Ks exhibit similar problem though. my yellow ('06) was fine (aside from slight notchiness, only in first) until the dealer screwed up! my red ('08) is "perfect"; it shifts flawlessly, cold or warmed up!

spets:
the tranny fluid was changed about 17k miles/2 years ago; ironically, to work in cold temperatures!! the diff. fluid was changed last year (5k miles ago).

i am going to schedule to bleed the clutch fluid and replace with Amsoil Brake fluid. will let the board know how that went.

thanks again to everyone; appreciate it.

niick

Wow, sorry I don't know what happened. I said spindle and I meant spline


I'm no mechanic myself, but to my understanding the spline is the part that holds the clutch assembly etc that allows the shifting of gears. Think of it like an axle that instead of wheels holds parts related to your transmission.

Without the grease on it, the common rust problem can occur which will prevent smooth shifting.

https://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/938...#entry21604945

http://s2000.com/forums/engine-tech-...da-tech-s.html

aviator

thanks, niick. i will have the disk spline checked. but, before spending time on it, i would have to determine if the spline is rusted, how would that make the problem go away after warmed up. i will talk to the tech for clarity.

thanks.

niick

If the spline is rusty, it will prevent a smooth transition. The transition not being very fluid might be the cause of your problems if it is catching.


Like I said, I am no by no means a mechanic and am just sharing some information I have gathered since my ownership of the car.