B.C.

https://www.s2ki.com/forums/index.ph...&f=16&t=419462

Thanks in advance.

BC

RED MX5

FM.

(Hopefully some of the geeks will know what that stands for. )

Kel

NFRs2000NYC

These things do "technically" work...however, on modern sports cars like s2000s, M3s, carreras, etc, they do nothing. The ideally equal out the electrical current in the car, thus, giving you the best possible spark. All sports cars already have this. If you have a 550hp s2000, you *might* see a 2-5 hp improvement with something like this....but not on a stock car.

However, they are NOT bs, like the tornado or whatever. On older cars, they do help a lot.

RED MX5

[QUOTE=NFRs2000NYC,Sep 5 2006, 03:44 PM]These things do "technically" work...however, on modern sports cars like s2000s, M3s, carreras, etc, they do nothing.

B.C.

Post on the other thread too guys!! Thanks!

NFRs2000NYC

Basically, just like in systems, if you have a bad ground..errors occur. In a system, your amps might shut off, they wont be as powerful as they could be, they will clip once you get past a certain volume, etc.

With bad spark, you can get misfires, or a slew of other problems. This is a non issue in modern cars. Older cars (Mustangs, Chevelles, Camaros, Challengers, GTOs, etc) do benefit from grounding systems.

I dont have an electrical engineering degree, so I honestly cant explain "technically" what the problem is, however, that is the basic explanation. Mine might be a little off even. I was just trying to explain what those "grounding systems" try to accomplish.

RED MX5

OK, it makes sense that fixing a system with a bad ground will solve any problems the bad ground is causing, but even back in the 60's cars tended to have very robust ground systems. If they're maintained, or replaced when needed, is there suppose to be some advantage to an aftermarket system over the OEM ground? I think they want us to believe that, but I can find no basis for any of their claims in any of the electronics I understand (which is admitedly limited).

Kirchhoff's law has to apply. I'd like to see a Thevenin's equivalent circuit that showed the difference between a properly functioning stock automotive electrical system and one using one of these magic boxes. If anybody here actually knows how these things are suppose to work then I'd really like to understand.

Clearly if a defective ground is replaced there will (or at least may) be positive side effects, but these things aren't being sold as a fix for defective grounds. They're being sold as performance enhancers, and that has a bit of a fishy smell to me.

We have never had ANY grounding problems on any of our Vettes or Camaros, going back to 1969, but I will grant you that some of those old cars had some funky wiring. Not the kind of thing an improved ground might fix, but they sure exhibited some wierd behavior at times. However, I doubt very seriously that any voltage or current fluctuations could be more detrimental to performance than the other sloppy aspects of those old motors; The accuracy of mechanical points and timing systems has got to swamp any differences caused by voltage variations (at least in a well maintained electrical system).

LOL, I'm like the OP; I'd really like to have an expert in electronics explain how these things are supposed to do what the manufacturers claim. I've been looking for an explination ever since I saw my first grounding kit, and the only ones that have ever made any sense is that they help if the car has a defective ground that needs repair. What I want to know is how they do the things the manufacturers claim on cars that are well maintained. Dyno charts that show variances that are well within the dyno's tolerance are meaningless, so we need to see some real circuit analysis (if such a thing is actually possible).

Come on guys. I know we have some EE's here. How does this stuff work? Is it FM (F***ing Magic) or is there a real gain to be had on cars that aren't having problems?

RED MX5

That'll teach you to double post.

You should ask one of the moderators to merge the threads.

Slows2k

He should know better

Keep the debate in one place please?