Paul S

Why? It was built with tracks in mind, not leisurely drives. That's why it doesn't come standard with A/C or the radio, either. The CR was built up like the ITR--shedding of items that weren't necessary for the tracks. Softtop was one of them. If you don't like it, get the base model. I don't know why people are bagging on the CR.

I, for one, am VERY excited that Honda has come out with this model. Shows that they still have their racing heritage in their system. The last car that I was excited about from Honda was the Integra Type R. Now, we've got something else to enjoy. (I'm talking State-side. I know JPN and the rest of the world gets all the cool cars...)

Ruprecht

I was excited about the Type R too...then again, it gave you 25HP more than the GS-R and 53HP more than the RS.

Paul S

Even with the engine aside, it had numerous upgrades. Even the chassis was different. I'd say even if it came with the B18C1 (GSR), I'd still take it. The balance is awesome, brakes are superb and has that raw racecar feel. I always regret selling her.....

Triple-H

I live in a part of the country where we get pop up showers all summer. It can be beautiful on the east side of one lake, and pouring like hell on the west side. The idea that you could pull out of your driveway when it is sunny without a top, and then get stranded in a downpour 50 miles from home with no roof is what I consider a f'ing stupid idea. Because of this the car would essentially become a coupe because the HT would never come off, thus a removable HT with no softtop is what I consider one very short sighted idea.

The CRX-Si has a metal sunroof, it can open and close to seal out the rain or welcome in the sunshine. A proper S2000 has this same capability because it has a retractable softtop.

Triple-H

I'm glad you are excited, but we do not share the same point of view, nor will we ever. Some of us "bag" on the CR model because we believe Honda could have done a WAY BETTER JOB. Yes, it is a more dedicated track car, but that does not mean it should sacrifice all levels of practicality.

Honda could have done way more to reduce weight so they could have kept the softtop. I think the majority of things Honda did to create the CR is great, it has many of the right features, but Honda got lazy when it came to the softtop, they could have saved weight someplace else and kept the folding top, but nooooo, they took the path of least resistance.

Honda should have done something that would bolster more sales, instead they spent a lot of R&D to make a car that fewer people will buy because it is so limited in its use.

BTW- have you seen the Top Gear episode where the old Civic Si kicks the crap out of the newer Civic Type R? The CR is not the only model Honda has screwed up...

thebig33tuna

I like everything they did with the CR with the exception of the hardtop. I'm not sure I'll ever have a non-convertible car from this point forward.

Get the base

Paul S

I have to ask you where Honda could've dropped more weight and still made it somewhat comfortable and with the same crash test rating. Where could have they dropped 50lbs from? They did not get lazy. They did the research. You don't slap together a car and turn faster track times. Shigeru Uehara is a perfectionist. NSX, ITR, S2000 all signify this.

Bottom line--a track car, like the CR, do not need a soft top. This is a big reason why many AP1/2 track guys throw it out.

Honda already knew that it would be appealing to a very limited number of people. Did you know that every single DC2R that Honda imported to the US, they lost money on. LOST MONEY! They knew this before they even sent the first chassis through production. They did it to showcase their heritage in racing. Which is what they are going for with the CR. They are NOT going for sales revenue.

As far as the Si vs. the new FD CTR, will you post the link? Which Si was it? The old old EF Si (something like 115hp) is no way in shape or form to compete with the new FD CTR that turned faster lap times than the DC2R and similar times as the S2000 (as Tsuzuka). EG and EM1 Si's are 116hp and 160hp, respectively, and in stock form, is not even a challenge. EP3's aren't even on blip on the radar on the new CTR's. Please don't believe everything you see on Top Gear. Great show, but I have raised an eyebrow or two at a few of their episodes.

Ruprecht

Sound like marketing hype. Can you point to a reference on this?

The net balance of component's removed (rag, rag frame, seats, ac, radio, spare, std tires) against the 'new' stuff added (hardtop, cloth seats, tire upgrade, suspension upgrades) is several thousand dollars cheaper on the CR.

So, then, someone claims "but what about the R&D?".

Well, let's see...how much R&D would it require to not install a soft top, not install a spare, not install AC, not install radio, change the assembly line kits on the suspension, seats, and add that WONDERFUL flying wing? Note that these kits are just that, a set of alternate components dropped off at the assembly station for that car. No robotic refits, or structure changes, or new crash data needed. No new transport and delivery footprint.

One million to plan this? Two million? How about 3 million? Surely for 3 million they could do this.

How many CRs were created by Dr. Frankenstein? 1,400? So that's $2142.86 per car just for 'R&D'. Way generous in my opinion.

The CR is still a cheaper ride to produce AND Honda is charging more for it. Their price differential makes up for 3 million R&D plus some. The money they save by keeping your rag top and frame and leather seats is gravy for them.

This is a car about hype. They are selling hype and a select set of individuals are buying hype.

Paul S

[QUOTE=Ruprecht]Sound like marketing hype.

Triple-H

They got lazy, or were just uninspired... You are putting Honda way too high up on a pedestal.

You want 50 pounds?
- lighter weight seats, stock seats are very heavy
- lighter weight exhaust, after market companies seem able to do it
- much less sound insulation, if you have never stripped a car you might not realize how heavy it is
- lighter weight forged wheels
- can of fix-a-flat so spare and tools are eliminated, BMW did this years ago
- redesigned simple interior without center storage and secret compartment

Want more?
- carbon fiber hood
- carbon fiber trunk lid