Noise canceling head phones in the s2000
02-28-2018 | 10:26 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 414
Likes: 32
Noise canceling head phones in the s2000
Hello, I've been using the QC25 Bose noise canceling ear buds for ear seal and not as obvious as the overear models. Had been running these for about two years now (on various loud cars/loud environments) and has been good but have some health/ear concern.
+ Can hear everything needed (horns, sirens, etc.) but while cutting out drone completely (Noise canceling on these ear buds as far as I know work in cutting out "constants" such as DRONE, TIRE DRONE, WIND NOISE DRONE etc.)
+ Can hear the pure mechanical sound of engine, exhaust working without the boom/drone. Swapped to a greddy SE single w/o hemholtz resonator two days ago. These ear buds almost completely removed the IMMENSE booming drone that the Greddy SE single exhaust produces in-cabin. I plan to be running this greddy SE single exhaust so -knock on wood- that this technological wizardry is saving my ears rather than masking damage. These ear buds make this exhaust sound like it truly should have as I can hear it climb the power band properly without the bs booming droning. Also it's a ver.1 or 2 without the hemholtz, not sure if the one with hemholtz is actually much better or not in drone department.
So far from the past two years of daily driving 7 days a week with the s2000 with these headphones I definitely feel much more refreshed or of zero fatigue when compared to getting open ears ripped apart (sometimes I want that open ear feel when driving super spirited.) It also seems that my hearing is better or did not degenerate over the past two years since wearing these when possible.
Now my concern is if somehow I am damaging my hearing doing this? As this "magic" of noise canceling I have zero knowledge on; is it masking the damage being done by high DB exposure to sound in constant OR is it actually working technological wizardry and my hearing is actually being saved? Also I slowly break off the ear seal when I spot a cop to avoid being hassled for earphones/talking on phone; with that comes an immediate exposure to the booming bass...
I'm not sure where to post this but perhaps some expert in the field or anyone with the knowledge can chime in.
thanks
+ Can hear everything needed (horns, sirens, etc.) but while cutting out drone completely (Noise canceling on these ear buds as far as I know work in cutting out "constants" such as DRONE, TIRE DRONE, WIND NOISE DRONE etc.)
+ Can hear the pure mechanical sound of engine, exhaust working without the boom/drone. Swapped to a greddy SE single w/o hemholtz resonator two days ago. These ear buds almost completely removed the IMMENSE booming drone that the Greddy SE single exhaust produces in-cabin. I plan to be running this greddy SE single exhaust so -knock on wood- that this technological wizardry is saving my ears rather than masking damage. These ear buds make this exhaust sound like it truly should have as I can hear it climb the power band properly without the bs booming droning. Also it's a ver.1 or 2 without the hemholtz, not sure if the one with hemholtz is actually much better or not in drone department.
So far from the past two years of daily driving 7 days a week with the s2000 with these headphones I definitely feel much more refreshed or of zero fatigue when compared to getting open ears ripped apart (sometimes I want that open ear feel when driving super spirited.) It also seems that my hearing is better or did not degenerate over the past two years since wearing these when possible.
Now my concern is if somehow I am damaging my hearing doing this? As this "magic" of noise canceling I have zero knowledge on; is it masking the damage being done by high DB exposure to sound in constant OR is it actually working technological wizardry and my hearing is actually being saved? Also I slowly break off the ear seal when I spot a cop to avoid being hassled for earphones/talking on phone; with that comes an immediate exposure to the booming bass...
I'm not sure where to post this but perhaps some expert in the field or anyone with the knowledge can chime in.
thanks
Last edited by EffWun; 02-28-2018 at 10:33 PM.
02-28-2018 | 10:54 PM
#2
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,116
Likes: 49
From: San Francisco
You don't want noise canceling headphones -- I never understood the concept of blasting your ear drums with more sound to cancel out existing sound... Sounds exhausting.
If you care about preserving your hearing -- and welcome to the club -- you need musicians earplugs.
I have personally been using these for years -- great top-down -- you can hear everything, but the ear-damaging decibels are lowered for your safety (makes road trips more enjoyable):
Etymotic Research ETY Plugs High Fidelity Earplugs; Standard Fit, Blue Tip, Polybag
And here are the technical/safety specs:
https://www.etymotic.com/downloads/d...n_brochure.pdf
If you care about preserving your hearing -- and welcome to the club -- you need musicians earplugs.
I have personally been using these for years -- great top-down -- you can hear everything, but the ear-damaging decibels are lowered for your safety (makes road trips more enjoyable):
Etymotic Research ETY Plugs High Fidelity Earplugs; Standard Fit, Blue Tip, Polybag
And here are the technical/safety specs:
https://www.etymotic.com/downloads/d...n_brochure.pdf
03-01-2018 | 03:17 AM
#3
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,297
Likes: 256
From: Vermont
I am not a fan of headphones or ear buds while driving. But, I do use over ear noise canceling Bose headphones at home from time to time and my experience is that they work extremely well to cut out extraneous noise/sound which has the effect of permitting me to listen to the music without higher volumes. I find them extremely effective, not exhausting at all. Quite relaxing actually. I don't turn on the noise cancelling feature all the time - only when needed. Trying to save the battery.
03-01-2018 | 07:18 AM
#4
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 6,006
Likes: 1,828
From: Foothills East of Sacramento
If you are worried about damaging your hearing in the long term, that is a valid concern especially with a convertible. As a military jet pilot/airline pilot I have taken a pretty strong interest in preserving my hearing. The bottom line is keeping the sound energy reaching your tympanic membranes (eardrums) to a minimum. I wear ear plugs under my helmet and even when I ride my mower. When I shoot, protection is a given.
I too find that driving with the top down on the highway can be pretty noisy. I will use earplugs (and crank up the stereo if I listen to music) while driving for a lengthy time on a freeway top down. I am much less stressed out and fatigued at the end of the drive. Noise cancelling headphones/buds work well at reducing wind and road noise. There may be safety concerns on an individual setup basis on not hearing something critical (I never, ever listen to music when I run or bike) so I never do this in an urban environment. A couple of times I have pulled out an earbud thinking I heard something odd but it has always been something in the background of the music. I live in the Sierra foothills and often drive 2 lane mountain roads with little traffic. If your ears are ringing a bit after listening to earbud music, even if they are noise cancelling, you are damaging your hearing.
I installed NVH (Noise, vibration, harshness) insulation (BQuiet and 3M automotive Thinsulate) in my floor and doors which had a very significant impact in ambient highway/transmission noise as well as making my sound system take off. I find that my wife and I can have a normal conversation on the freeway without raising our voices at all, This is top up, of course. The sound insulation in the doors boosted the music so I can hear it much better (even with plugs in) with the top down. Driving next to a semi pretty much kills it however!
I too find that driving with the top down on the highway can be pretty noisy. I will use earplugs (and crank up the stereo if I listen to music) while driving for a lengthy time on a freeway top down. I am much less stressed out and fatigued at the end of the drive. Noise cancelling headphones/buds work well at reducing wind and road noise. There may be safety concerns on an individual setup basis on not hearing something critical (I never, ever listen to music when I run or bike) so I never do this in an urban environment. A couple of times I have pulled out an earbud thinking I heard something odd but it has always been something in the background of the music. I live in the Sierra foothills and often drive 2 lane mountain roads with little traffic. If your ears are ringing a bit after listening to earbud music, even if they are noise cancelling, you are damaging your hearing.
I installed NVH (Noise, vibration, harshness) insulation (BQuiet and 3M automotive Thinsulate) in my floor and doors which had a very significant impact in ambient highway/transmission noise as well as making my sound system take off. I find that my wife and I can have a normal conversation on the freeway without raising our voices at all, This is top up, of course. The sound insulation in the doors boosted the music so I can hear it much better (even with plugs in) with the top down. Driving next to a semi pretty much kills it however!
03-01-2018 | 08:29 PM
#5
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 414
Likes: 32
Hey, thanks for responses.
@Harry, yes my thoughts exactly with the canceling noise with more noise. Although these QC25 buds produce white noise that is very minimal and makes the s2000 drive very relaxing, peaceful, and all drones do not exist. Can listen to music well at between 2-5 blocks on the iphone volume, more if I really want to get into it. I think it has up to 16 blocks of volume according to my iphone 6.
because agreeable that NC is pretty much sound canceling sound, I will definitely look into the links you provided and read upon the ETY plugs and related items.
@rpg I've never used the over head/ears but I do as well find the noise canceling playing into being relaxed and less/not exhausted. Although with the s2000 I will activate the noise canceling upon the moment I sit in it; it really cuts the noise so much I feel it is much quieter than even a 1998 Lexus LS400 I had in the past.
@Cosmos Agreed with reducing overall sound to the ear drum. The seal of the earbud to the ear should be similar to ear plugs; it feels as if the noise canceling QC25 buds does keep the sound to the ear drums at a minimum (significantly more with the noise cancel activated, like sitting in a S class mercedes or previously owned LS400). Hearing something critical was definitely in mind, I do hear the sirens, car horns, yelling humans, etc. Although slightly muffled, I do keep music low or drive without music.
I do have 3m Thinsulate roll from a ebay purchase actually; you remind me I have it and I shall get to installing it. Did you install the fluffy side against the metal or the black side? I'm not sure how I was going to fixture this thing i.e.) adhesive spray/3m tape or just stuff/wedge it to shape in the panel or floorboard and hope it sits. I'm definitely very tempted to apply my limited roll to the mugen replica hard top firstly as it's a single side CF and probably contributes to the drone. Even thouugh mentioned drone doesn't exist with NC activated, will still want to apply this stuff for precautions or for when wanting to go super spirited driving without headphones.
@Harry, yes my thoughts exactly with the canceling noise with more noise. Although these QC25 buds produce white noise that is very minimal and makes the s2000 drive very relaxing, peaceful, and all drones do not exist. Can listen to music well at between 2-5 blocks on the iphone volume, more if I really want to get into it. I think it has up to 16 blocks of volume according to my iphone 6.
because agreeable that NC is pretty much sound canceling sound, I will definitely look into the links you provided and read upon the ETY plugs and related items.
@rpg I've never used the over head/ears but I do as well find the noise canceling playing into being relaxed and less/not exhausted. Although with the s2000 I will activate the noise canceling upon the moment I sit in it; it really cuts the noise so much I feel it is much quieter than even a 1998 Lexus LS400 I had in the past.
@Cosmos Agreed with reducing overall sound to the ear drum. The seal of the earbud to the ear should be similar to ear plugs; it feels as if the noise canceling QC25 buds does keep the sound to the ear drums at a minimum (significantly more with the noise cancel activated, like sitting in a S class mercedes or previously owned LS400). Hearing something critical was definitely in mind, I do hear the sirens, car horns, yelling humans, etc. Although slightly muffled, I do keep music low or drive without music.
I do have 3m Thinsulate roll from a ebay purchase actually; you remind me I have it and I shall get to installing it. Did you install the fluffy side against the metal or the black side? I'm not sure how I was going to fixture this thing i.e.) adhesive spray/3m tape or just stuff/wedge it to shape in the panel or floorboard and hope it sits. I'm definitely very tempted to apply my limited roll to the mugen replica hard top firstly as it's a single side CF and probably contributes to the drone. Even thouugh mentioned drone doesn't exist with NC activated, will still want to apply this stuff for precautions or for when wanting to go super spirited driving without headphones.
Last edited by EffWun; 03-01-2018 at 08:41 PM.
03-01-2018 | 09:09 PM
#6
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 6,006
Likes: 1,828
From: Foothills East of Sacramento
Did you install the fluffy side against the metal or the black side? I'm not sure how I was going to fixture this thing i.e.) adhesive spray/3m tape or just stuff/wedge it to shape in the panel or floorboard and hope it sits. I'm definitely very tempted to apply my limited roll to the mugen replica hard top firstly as it's a single side CF and probably contributes to the drone. Even thouugh mentioned drone doesn't exist with NC activated, will still want to apply this stuff for precautions or for when wanting to go super spirited driving without headphones.
https://www.s2ki.com/forums/s2000-ta...sults-1085903/
03-02-2018 | 04:06 AM
#7
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 332
Likes: 102
That is a great question and here is a good answer. I was curious about this because I find the drone from my Greddy Ti-C single with HFC (I have plans to change but not in the near future) fatiguing for long drives. I have tried QC35 headphones for my car and they do a GREAT job at taking down the drone levels. Obviously not so great for the firing range since not a steady-state noise, but for driving, I think it should work well at protecting your ears - they work by taking cancelling out the drone and reducing the amount that gets to your ears.
I have tried regular earplugs, they work OK, but not so great for the low frequency drone that my exhaust puts out and it still ends up being pretty fatiguing on long drives.
Thanks for making me look this up. Looks like a couple sets of NC headphones will be on order soon for me.
https://www.reddit.com/r/askscience/..._protect_your/
Another article: https://ohsonline.com/Articles/2007/...on.aspx?Page=4
I have tried regular earplugs, they work OK, but not so great for the low frequency drone that my exhaust puts out and it still ends up being pretty fatiguing on long drives.
Thanks for making me look this up. Looks like a couple sets of NC headphones will be on order soon for me.
https://www.reddit.com/r/askscience/..._protect_your/
I'm an acoustician. Noise cancelling headphones definitely reduce the noise level hitting your ear, but this won't necessarily be useful in all settings.
There are a few assumptions not stated here. One is that the active noise control system is able to effectively cancel out the type of noise reaching your ear. As you said, the system typically doesn't work well with impulsive noises, and it also typically doesn't handle noise sources like speech or music very well. It will reduce the noise level, but not as effectively as it will attenuate steady background noise. So if the noise you're exposed to isn't steady and unchanging, the active noise cancellation system inherently does worse than a passive system (ear plugs).
The other important thing to note is that the active noise cancellation system is limited by the power it can output. So if you were trying to cancel out the sound of a gunshot, the headphones would need to be able to output as much sound pressure as is acting upon your eardrum. Granted, this doesn't mean it has to have nearly the same sound power as the gun itself is producing, but it's still quite loud.
So active noise cancellation will protect your hearing when you're in a steady noise environment, like a plane, for a long period of time. But it isn't as effective as passive noise control in all settings.
There are a few assumptions not stated here. One is that the active noise control system is able to effectively cancel out the type of noise reaching your ear. As you said, the system typically doesn't work well with impulsive noises, and it also typically doesn't handle noise sources like speech or music very well. It will reduce the noise level, but not as effectively as it will attenuate steady background noise. So if the noise you're exposed to isn't steady and unchanging, the active noise cancellation system inherently does worse than a passive system (ear plugs).
The other important thing to note is that the active noise cancellation system is limited by the power it can output. So if you were trying to cancel out the sound of a gunshot, the headphones would need to be able to output as much sound pressure as is acting upon your eardrum. Granted, this doesn't mean it has to have nearly the same sound power as the gun itself is producing, but it's still quite loud.
So active noise cancellation will protect your hearing when you're in a steady noise environment, like a plane, for a long period of time. But it isn't as effective as passive noise control in all settings.
Conclusion
ANR is the next technological breakthrough in industrial hearing protection because it remedies the noise problems that previously had no solution. There have been no significant advances in passive hearing protection, because passive is well understood and has been fully exploited. The only opportunity to provide workers with the next generation in hearing protection will be through electronic means such as ANR.
ANR is the next technological breakthrough in industrial hearing protection because it remedies the noise problems that previously had no solution. There have been no significant advances in passive hearing protection, because passive is well understood and has been fully exploited. The only opportunity to provide workers with the next generation in hearing protection will be through electronic means such as ANR.
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03-03-2018 | 07:36 PM
#8
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 414
Likes: 32
@threed Nice find, some peace of mind with these qc25 now. Will look further into it. Let me know how it goes for you if you purchase some noise canceling
@Cosmos Thanks, will be looking through your threads. Great detail.
@Cosmos Thanks, will be looking through your threads. Great detail.
03-04-2018 | 03:47 AM
#9
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,297
Likes: 256
From: Vermont
What I don't understand is why we all seem compelled to put an intake and exhaust on our cars that generally results in louder and sweeter sounds, (but very small performance gains, if any), and then we go to all sorts of lengths to insulate ourselves from the noise. 
03-04-2018 | 04:10 AM
#10
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 12,933
Likes: 1,266
From: Chesterfield VA
Noise canceling ear muffs do not allow the secondary, loud cancelling noise to reach the ear drums. They actually cancel the noise -- hence the nomenclature.
I simply selected a proper exhaust so have no need for them roof up or down. Folks with Alpha Hotel exhaust systems may benefit.
-- Chuck
I simply selected a proper exhaust so have no need for them roof up or down. Folks with Alpha Hotel exhaust systems may benefit.
-- Chuck