New S200 sales continue To decline
06-08-2005, 01:02 PM
#43
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Cthree-when I helped start the Honda Acura Club we had the same issues. Marketing Dept was a joke. Nobody would call you back. Nobody could make a decision. Dealing w/ Honda was a nightmare. We gave up after 5 years and called it quits. I like the product, but that`s about it.....
Kurt Antonius
. I am sure you agree.
Ryan
Kurt Antonius
. I am sure you agree.Ryan
06-08-2005, 01:13 PM
#44
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Originally Posted by cthree,Jun 8 2005, 12:40 PM
I don't think generalizing about the heath and welfare of the population is accurate. The other statement made is that once that market is saturated nobody will have a need for one because all the potential buyers already have one. Then you go on to say "sell me one please...". You are a testament against your own argument. People buy and sell cars all the time.
People age and they change life circumstances as they do. People get out of college, get a good job and then treat themselves with a toy they've always dreamed of. They buy it and then 4 or 5 years down the road they have kids and trade in their sports cars for SUVs. Then the kids grow up and they dream once again of recapturing their youth so go out and buy another sports car again. This is how industry works. Trends and market conditions change over time as do peoples attitudes. They don't stop buying small cars because they are to fat to fit in them anymore.
For the record, I fit fine.
People age and they change life circumstances as they do. People get out of college, get a good job and then treat themselves with a toy they've always dreamed of. They buy it and then 4 or 5 years down the road they have kids and trade in their sports cars for SUVs. Then the kids grow up and they dream once again of recapturing their youth so go out and buy another sports car again. This is how industry works. Trends and market conditions change over time as do peoples attitudes. They don't stop buying small cars because they are to fat to fit in them anymore.
For the record, I fit fine.
The fat part of my argument is not meant to be the main point, I am sorry if it came across that way. But the fact is Americans are getting bigger, and the producers are making bigger cars to meet the demand, look at the Miata. Your point on rolling life cycle is very valid... but it would not surprise me if people waited a little longer for the S to come out before buying it, or speed up on getting the S because it is just too cool not to have... again, ergo higher sales in the earlier years and lacking sales afterwards... plus what other people say about new roadsters coming out also fit into this.
But c'mon, people, economics is a science of hindsights, I may be totally off the course, but don't go poking holes in my argument so fast
06-08-2005, 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted by STL,Jun 8 2005, 11:06 AM
WTF are to talking about? The Saturn isn't even out yet and I don't think the Pontiacs have really hit the street yet. Neither of those cars have have any measurable effect on S2000 sales!
06-08-2005, 04:32 PM
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Originally Posted by STL,Jun 8 2005, 11:16 AM
Maybe for a several months, but not for several years. So in this case that arguement is 
. Futhermore, the "average joe" consumer has no idea what new cars are even coming until the manufacturer starts advertising them (which doesn't happen until a few month before their release).
Besides I doubt many people are putting off buying a TL because a new Civic is coming out this fall. That's about the same as saying someone would put off buying a S2000 because the Saturn Sky is coming out next year.
. Futhermore, the "average joe" consumer has no idea what new cars are even coming until the manufacturer starts advertising them (which doesn't happen until a few month before their release). Besides I doubt many people are putting off buying a TL because a new Civic is coming out this fall. That's about the same as saying someone would put off buying a S2000 because the Saturn Sky is coming out next year.
06-08-2005, 04:35 PM
#48
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cthree, great post back on page one - I really have nothing more to add, your argument was so comprehensive, but I'll write some stuff anyway. Personally, the S wasn't even on my radar when I started looking at a new car last yr. Thank God I saw that yellow S sitting on the lot, and took the chance....
People want fresh, new stuff, which is why product lifecycles are so short in the US. Its remarkable that cars like the Boxster go so long between updates, and that the 911 is essentially recognizable no matter what year you come from. This is also the reason BMW took such a radical design change with its "flame" surfacing. The S is basically the same design its always been. Plus, 30k is a lot to pay for a few-frills roadster.
Although advanced for its time, time is catching up, and the wow features on the original S are more common today, and people are being shown flashier stuff. Plus, with the new Mustang, Boxster, Miata, Solstice in the market, there are a lot of flashier, better marketed cars out there. I've seen more Solstice commercials already than all the S commercials I've ever seen.
Maybe at Duke, but not at Carolina! 
People want fresh, new stuff, which is why product lifecycles are so short in the US. Its remarkable that cars like the Boxster go so long between updates, and that the 911 is essentially recognizable no matter what year you come from. This is also the reason BMW took such a radical design change with its "flame" surfacing. The S is basically the same design its always been. Plus, 30k is a lot to pay for a few-frills roadster.
Although advanced for its time, time is catching up, and the wow features on the original S are more common today, and people are being shown flashier stuff. Plus, with the new Mustang, Boxster, Miata, Solstice in the market, there are a lot of flashier, better marketed cars out there. I've seen more Solstice commercials already than all the S commercials I've ever seen.
a lot of people are fat in this country, and many of them morbidly obese (especially in the NC, hard to find someone over 30 who is still fit here).
06-08-2005, 05:19 PM
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We have a different kind of problem in my area. Our market is flooded with used S2000 because kids would buy them for the hype and glory in the name of the car. They would take it home and get beaten down by their friends' 350, the new Mustang, G35, M3s etc...they'll go back and ditch the car for one of those. Sad.
06-08-2005, 05:25 PM
#50
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A few thoughts:
First, the redesign has nothing to do with sales. I started to desire the car during the first years of production, then continued to desire the car after the 04 models came out. Unless you've driven a 00-03, you won't have any idea about the difference. Most people who are taking this into account have owned one of the earlier cars.
Second, I think the entire "sports car" market is rapidly changing. People who wanted S2K's or Miatas a few years ago are buying Evos and WRXs. It's sad, because those are NOT sports cars, but to the "I want to be trendy and go fast" crowd, those are the hot item.
Even within the 2-seater market, there have been big advances. The new Z4 is great compared to the Z3. The 350z is everywhere. The new Corvette is still one of the most desired cars out there. People who buy roadsters are usually doing so with disposable income and want something new and exciting. The S2000 is now 5+ years old... people who want flare are going toward whatever came out last month.
Of course, the marketing (or lack thereof) is a problem too. 18 year-olds are buying Evos for $30k. Honda is a youth-oriented company... yet they never put 2+2 together and market the S2000 to kids. I don't get this.
First, the redesign has nothing to do with sales. I started to desire the car during the first years of production, then continued to desire the car after the 04 models came out. Unless you've driven a 00-03, you won't have any idea about the difference. Most people who are taking this into account have owned one of the earlier cars.
Second, I think the entire "sports car" market is rapidly changing. People who wanted S2K's or Miatas a few years ago are buying Evos and WRXs. It's sad, because those are NOT sports cars, but to the "I want to be trendy and go fast" crowd, those are the hot item.
Even within the 2-seater market, there have been big advances. The new Z4 is great compared to the Z3. The 350z is everywhere. The new Corvette is still one of the most desired cars out there. People who buy roadsters are usually doing so with disposable income and want something new and exciting. The S2000 is now 5+ years old... people who want flare are going toward whatever came out last month.
Of course, the marketing (or lack thereof) is a problem too. 18 year-olds are buying Evos for $30k. Honda is a youth-oriented company... yet they never put 2+2 together and market the S2000 to kids. I don't get this.