Edmunds first drive of 2004
10-02-2003 | 09:29 AM
#42
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,572
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From: St. Louis
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Road Rage
Maybe in Nascar, certainly not F1. Dunno abut S2000 Grand Prix.
At driving school, we were taught this definition of a skid:
"Anytime your wheels are moving at different speeds".
Maybe in Nascar, certainly not F1. Dunno abut S2000 Grand Prix.
At driving school, we were taught this definition of a skid:
"Anytime your wheels are moving at different speeds".
10-02-2003 | 10:51 AM
#43
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Joined: Jul 2003
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From: Portland, OR
It's not ABS, it's a brake balance system that now accounts for side-to-side variances in addition to the existing electronic proportioning front-to-rear.
10-02-2003 | 10:53 AM
#44
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Joined: Oct 2002
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From: Pearland
Originally posted by Quick2K
i love how everyone has complained about the "softening" of the S2000 for more "common" drivers. yet in essentially the same sentence, people also wonder if they can swap MY04 exterior bits and brightwork into their pre MY04 models. If the 00-03 cars are so "classic"....wouldn't it deface them to add later model pieces to them? Maybe it's just me, but a pre MY04 is a fabulous, and distinct car, and the MY04+ models are fabulous, and distinct as well...please, no inbreeding.
Quick2K
i love how everyone has complained about the "softening" of the S2000 for more "common" drivers. yet in essentially the same sentence, people also wonder if they can swap MY04 exterior bits and brightwork into their pre MY04 models. If the 00-03 cars are so "classic"....wouldn't it deface them to add later model pieces to them? Maybe it's just me, but a pre MY04 is a fabulous, and distinct car, and the MY04+ models are fabulous, and distinct as well...please, no inbreeding.
Quick2K
. That's probably it. The new rear bumper looks too "Veilside" to me. It's still nice in it's own way..
10-02-2003 | 12:39 PM
#45
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From: Bay Area
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Russ
The phrase "Track performance is something every prospective S2000 owner should consider, because there's little reason to buy one unless it's going to spend some time on a race course." soured my opinion of the article.
I have clearly written several times in the past that I'm no stranger to road courses and high performance driving schools but to assume the car has no worth on public roads to the average automobile enthusiast (who does NOT track the car) is just plain ignorant.
One does NOT have to be graded with a timer nor go to Laguna Seca to enjoy the S2000 any more than another who is required to enlist in the Army to enjoy their Hummer.
This is the kind of automobile writing that really pisses me off.
The phrase "Track performance is something every prospective S2000 owner should consider, because there's little reason to buy one unless it's going to spend some time on a race course." soured my opinion of the article.
I have clearly written several times in the past that I'm no stranger to road courses and high performance driving schools but to assume the car has no worth on public roads to the average automobile enthusiast (who does NOT track the car) is just plain ignorant.
One does NOT have to be graded with a timer nor go to Laguna Seca to enjoy the S2000 any more than another who is required to enlist in the Army to enjoy their Hummer.
This is the kind of automobile writing that really pisses me off.
10-02-2003 | 02:19 PM
#46
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From: Land of the landeaus
No, that's NOT what he's implying. Read his idotic statement again, "Track performance is something every prospective S2000 owner should consider, because there's little reason to buy one unless it's going to spend some time on a race course."
Are you trying to tell the rest of us who haven't taken the car to the track (in my case, we had none in my former state) that we just use the car to go grocery shopping or that the car cannot be enjoyed driving it aggressively on paved roads without supervision? My last sportscar, a Toyota MR2 Spyder (modified to 152hp with 200-lbs of weight reduction which resulted in 0-60's just a tick past 6-seconds flat) was nearly as quick on those back roads as the S2000 and I can assure you, the only thing following me was the wind. I don't get some of you guys who actually think the car isn't being pushed unless it's on a track. Maybe YOU don't push it but there are TONS of roads out there where you can explore the car's abilities without scaring the crap out of yourself. Can you drive it quicker AT a track? I would imagine "yes" and following track time, I would also assume you could take that knowledge and return to those backroads and drive your car quicker and BETTER. I don't see how anyone could think of this car as a black and white ownership experience... meaning, unless it gets driven hard at a track, the car is not really seeing its purpose fulfilled. Let me ask you this...if Honda's main focus behind the car was to make it a track car, they wouldn't have worried about baffles in the intake (which limits intake noise) at the expense of a few horsepower, they would have created a less (and lighter) exhaust system, etc, etc.
The car was designed for the majority of automobile enthusiasts who I repeat, DO NOT have the opportunities to track the vehicle but in spite of that, know how to have fun with a front engine, rear wheel drive sportscar.
The writer of the story was enjoying his track experience so much it clouded his judgement. One needn't let trees to their port and starboard scare 'em out of a fun drive. Yes, I'm sure you'll have less of a "white knuckle" drive when the only thing between you and a spin is 20-yards of sand, I won't argue that point, but
I'd rather drive 7/10th's on a deserted back road than 10/10th's on a barren track any day of the week and I can say that because I've done both...in cars just as performance focused as the S2000. To close, your comment that the only way to safely drive the car to honor its purpose is on a track. I'll counter that by saying a poor driver at the track is a poor driver anywhere. What determines safety isn't the road surface, it's the driver and their experience. I began heel and toeing in 1976 and it didn't require seat time at LeMans to figure out how to enjoy any of the 20-plus sportscars I've owned since then.
I've spent many weekends at tracks over my lifetime and miss the experiences, the friendships built and knowledge derived but it is not mandatory to haul your convertible to the track in order to enjoy it safely...if I'm not mistaken, I don't think Geddy Lee wrote "Red Barchetta," an ode to his childhood, with Sebring in mind.
Are you trying to tell the rest of us who haven't taken the car to the track (in my case, we had none in my former state) that we just use the car to go grocery shopping or that the car cannot be enjoyed driving it aggressively on paved roads without supervision? My last sportscar, a Toyota MR2 Spyder (modified to 152hp with 200-lbs of weight reduction which resulted in 0-60's just a tick past 6-seconds flat) was nearly as quick on those back roads as the S2000 and I can assure you, the only thing following me was the wind. I don't get some of you guys who actually think the car isn't being pushed unless it's on a track. Maybe YOU don't push it but there are TONS of roads out there where you can explore the car's abilities without scaring the crap out of yourself. Can you drive it quicker AT a track? I would imagine "yes" and following track time, I would also assume you could take that knowledge and return to those backroads and drive your car quicker and BETTER. I don't see how anyone could think of this car as a black and white ownership experience... meaning, unless it gets driven hard at a track, the car is not really seeing its purpose fulfilled. Let me ask you this...if Honda's main focus behind the car was to make it a track car, they wouldn't have worried about baffles in the intake (which limits intake noise) at the expense of a few horsepower, they would have created a less (and lighter) exhaust system, etc, etc.
The car was designed for the majority of automobile enthusiasts who I repeat, DO NOT have the opportunities to track the vehicle but in spite of that, know how to have fun with a front engine, rear wheel drive sportscar.
The writer of the story was enjoying his track experience so much it clouded his judgement. One needn't let trees to their port and starboard scare 'em out of a fun drive. Yes, I'm sure you'll have less of a "white knuckle" drive when the only thing between you and a spin is 20-yards of sand, I won't argue that point, but
I'd rather drive 7/10th's on a deserted back road than 10/10th's on a barren track any day of the week and I can say that because I've done both...in cars just as performance focused as the S2000. To close, your comment that the only way to safely drive the car to honor its purpose is on a track. I'll counter that by saying a poor driver at the track is a poor driver anywhere. What determines safety isn't the road surface, it's the driver and their experience. I began heel and toeing in 1976 and it didn't require seat time at LeMans to figure out how to enjoy any of the 20-plus sportscars I've owned since then.
I've spent many weekends at tracks over my lifetime and miss the experiences, the friendships built and knowledge derived but it is not mandatory to haul your convertible to the track in order to enjoy it safely...if I'm not mistaken, I don't think Geddy Lee wrote "Red Barchetta," an ode to his childhood, with Sebring in mind.
10-02-2003 | 02:39 PM
#47
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Joined: Feb 2003
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From: Bay Area
ok, maybe he should have written this instead:
"Track performance is something every prospective S2000 owner should consider, because there's little reason to buy one unless it's going to spend some time on a race course. Well, you can also drive it hard in the twisties, but don't blame me when you crash and go over a cliff or hit another car."
I think you're feeling offended for no real reason. To safely drive a card to its limits you should go to the track. The s2000 needs to be driven hard.....to safely drive it hard, go to the track.
a little hyperbolic is the statement? maybe, but it's "true" nonetheless.
"Track performance is something every prospective S2000 owner should consider, because there's little reason to buy one unless it's going to spend some time on a race course. Well, you can also drive it hard in the twisties, but don't blame me when you crash and go over a cliff or hit another car."
I think you're feeling offended for no real reason. To safely drive a card to its limits you should go to the track. The s2000 needs to be driven hard.....to safely drive it hard, go to the track.
a little hyperbolic is the statement? maybe, but it's "true" nonetheless.
10-02-2003 | 02:49 PM
#49
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From: Land of the landeaus
We'll agree to disagree. You probably don't have my experience, nor that of other veteran S2000 owners, so I encourage you to take your car to the track so you can learn what it can and can't do, especially since you feel no one can drive it safely on a public road and illicit a grin. The one phrase you repeat which baffles me is your apparent belief that a car has to be taken to the "limits" in order to enjoy it and worse, "the S2000 needs to be driven hard." Why would you think this? Did you take it to the track before buying? You obviously took a test drive and I dare say it wasn't at Laguna Seca so there must of been something that you found enjoyable during your first meeting behind the wheel on a public road that hooked you. With that thought in mind, I highly doubt there is a long list of owners here lamenting their S2000 purchase because they bought the car and now realize with three kids, an 80-hr week job, etc getting to a track each weekend just isn't feasible. Might as well trade in it at that point, eh? I mean, how could anyone possibly enjoy their S2000 on eeeeks! a public road! Afterall, it "needs to be pushed."
Everyone is entitled to define their own ownership experience but to assume one owner "gets it" and another doesn't simply is arrogant automotive journalism at its worst. I don't ever recall CAR or Top Gear magazine saying a Vantage has to be taken to the track to enjoy it. Nobody argues a track is a safer place to explore one's abilities (not just the car's) but I never took my Alfa Spyder Veloce to the track (unlike my GTV6) but strange enough, enjoyed it just as much on those Virginia backroads.
Everyone is entitled to define their own ownership experience but to assume one owner "gets it" and another doesn't simply is arrogant automotive journalism at its worst. I don't ever recall CAR or Top Gear magazine saying a Vantage has to be taken to the track to enjoy it. Nobody argues a track is a safer place to explore one's abilities (not just the car's) but I never took my Alfa Spyder Veloce to the track (unlike my GTV6) but strange enough, enjoyed it just as much on those Virginia backroads.