Did the S2000 come before the NSX? You be the judge...
04-26-2003, 07:34 PM
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Did the S2000 come before the NSX? You be the judge...
Not sure if you have seen the book: "Honda S2000" by Daniel F. Carney, 2001, Motorbooks International (MBI Publishing Company), ISBN 0-7603-0906-X.
Here are some excerpts:
Page 31
"While Honda was dominating Formula One racing, the company decided that it wanted a road car that reflected its stature as a high-performance company that could beat the likes of Ferrari....
"...the company initially planned a smaller, 2 liter machine. Shigeru Uehara, the S2000's chief engineer, worked as project leader on the NSX. The NSX grew to a six-cylinder machine...but Uehara and his colleagues remembered the original plan for a smaller, more elemental sports car when they started working on the S2000 in late 1995."
Page 35
"While [high price and limited production are] good for infusing the NSX with an exotic aura, [they aren't] as good for putting a lot of high performance Honda products in the hands of enthusiasts. For that, Honda dusted off its original idea for the NSX, a lighter, 2-liter machine."
Page 37
"Shigeru Uehara, Honda's executive chief engineer for the S2000, felt the pull of unfinished business in 1995. He had sucessfully overseen the development of Honda's technological tour de force, the NSX...But one of the proposals for the project that yielded the NSX was a lightweight, 2-liter roadster."
"...'we selected the format of a two-seater, front-engine, rear-wheel-drive sports car with a convertible top, equipped with a 2-liter engine.'"
By the way, it is an excellent book, with much more about design goals, philosophy, development and testing...Also, lots of direct quotes from key Honda employees.
Here are some excerpts:
Page 31
"While Honda was dominating Formula One racing, the company decided that it wanted a road car that reflected its stature as a high-performance company that could beat the likes of Ferrari....
"...the company initially planned a smaller, 2 liter machine. Shigeru Uehara, the S2000's chief engineer, worked as project leader on the NSX. The NSX grew to a six-cylinder machine...but Uehara and his colleagues remembered the original plan for a smaller, more elemental sports car when they started working on the S2000 in late 1995."
Page 35
"While [high price and limited production are] good for infusing the NSX with an exotic aura, [they aren't] as good for putting a lot of high performance Honda products in the hands of enthusiasts. For that, Honda dusted off its original idea for the NSX, a lighter, 2-liter machine."
Page 37
"Shigeru Uehara, Honda's executive chief engineer for the S2000, felt the pull of unfinished business in 1995. He had sucessfully overseen the development of Honda's technological tour de force, the NSX...But one of the proposals for the project that yielded the NSX was a lightweight, 2-liter roadster."
"...'we selected the format of a two-seater, front-engine, rear-wheel-drive sports car with a convertible top, equipped with a 2-liter engine.'"
By the way, it is an excellent book, with much more about design goals, philosophy, development and testing...Also, lots of direct quotes from key Honda employees.
04-26-2003, 10:37 PM
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Soichiro's first vision for a car was a 2 seat roadster. I've read that's the type of car where his passion for driving goes into. So in a way, yes, the concept of the S2000 was around a lot longer than the NSX. It was called something different. S500 I believe?
04-27-2003, 03:18 AM
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Yes, there was the S500, S600 and S800 in the early 1960s.
In fact, the book shows an open-wheel Grand Prix-type racer called The Curtis that Mr. Honda helped develop in the late 1920's while apprenticing at a local Tokyo garage.
He himself raced Honda open-wheel racing cars until a crash in 1962 or so, after which he promised his family to give up competition driving.
Enzo Ferrari built an automobile company to finance racing which was his true passion, whereas Porsche was himself never a competition driver, but was motivated more by his passion for engineering. Soichiro Honda seems to have been a perfect cross between the two, motivated by passions for racing and for engineering, with commercial dominance thrown in for good measure. Honda is the only large car company still in existence that was founded by a racer.
An interesting aside from another book: Just before WWII, Mr. Honda, not wanting to be part of the war machine, sold his business at the time (a piston ring manufacturing operation) to Toyota and literally moved to the hills, opened a sake brewery and waited out the war. Unique guy.
In fact, the book shows an open-wheel Grand Prix-type racer called The Curtis that Mr. Honda helped develop in the late 1920's while apprenticing at a local Tokyo garage.
He himself raced Honda open-wheel racing cars until a crash in 1962 or so, after which he promised his family to give up competition driving.
Enzo Ferrari built an automobile company to finance racing which was his true passion, whereas Porsche was himself never a competition driver, but was motivated more by his passion for engineering. Soichiro Honda seems to have been a perfect cross between the two, motivated by passions for racing and for engineering, with commercial dominance thrown in for good measure. Honda is the only large car company still in existence that was founded by a racer.
An interesting aside from another book: Just before WWII, Mr. Honda, not wanting to be part of the war machine, sold his business at the time (a piston ring manufacturing operation) to Toyota and literally moved to the hills, opened a sake brewery and waited out the war. Unique guy.
04-27-2003, 04:42 AM
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Perhaps the concept of the S2000 was the foundation for the creation of the NSX, but as I recall, the NSX was one of the first offerings from Acura when Acura was launched in late 1986. First NSX I saw was prominently displayed in the window of Montclair (NJ) Acura for something like $95,000 and it sold quickly.
04-27-2003, 04:44 AM
#5
Originally posted by pdippell
Yes, there was the S500, S600 and S800 in the early 1960s.
An interesting aside from another book: Just before WWII, Mr. Honda, not wanting to be part of the war machine, sold his business at the time (a piston ring manufacturing operation) to Toyota and literally moved to the hills, opened a sake brewery and waited out the war. Unique guy.
Yes, there was the S500, S600 and S800 in the early 1960s.
An interesting aside from another book: Just before WWII, Mr. Honda, not wanting to be part of the war machine, sold his business at the time (a piston ring manufacturing operation) to Toyota and literally moved to the hills, opened a sake brewery and waited out the war. Unique guy.
Although like Henry Ford, Honda was a pacifist, during the Second World War he invented a machine that honed aircraft propellers for Mitsubishi. Before then, the Japanese had always made propellers by hand.
After the war, with his country in ruins, Honda just gave up on life. There weren't many cars on the road, therefore few to repair. He hated the fact that he had helped the Japanese war machine, so when Toyota came to him to buy his piston manufacturing company, Honda sold it for the equivalent of $200,000 in today's money. And the first thing Honda did was take $10,000, go to the local hospital and bribe them out of a 50-gallon drum of medical alcohol with which he proceeded to distill homemade sake. And then our automotive genius went on a non-stop bender.
Conquering Shame Takes Work
Honda awoke two years later, in 1947, broke and with no future. Everything he had owned he had spent, sold or given away. Desperate to reclaim his life, he shamefacedly borrowed $3,500 from his family. With that loan he would start the company that now carries his name.
04-27-2003, 04:54 AM
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by djohnston
[B]Perhaps the concept of the S2000 was the foundation for the creation of the NSX, but as I recall, the NSX was one of the first offerings from Acura when Acura was launched in late 1986.
[B]Perhaps the concept of the S2000 was the foundation for the creation of the NSX, but as I recall, the NSX was one of the first offerings from Acura when Acura was launched in late 1986.
