s2000Junky

The PSS is a single ply sidewall tire, so chances are its not going to feel any more crisp/firm in the handling department over the S04 or even what you just took off. It will grip better in the dry however. Really its trading one apple for another in my book until your willing to step up to a proper Extreme summer tire on this car. Its not just about the better traction, its the construction of the tire and what it offers handling wise that make the equal difference. Most extreme summers will last 15-20k road miles given a good alignment, and usually more up front, which is long enough for you to want to try out the next gen offering in the mileage you place on them in a season. Extreme summers work fine in the wet if you drive like a normal person, but offer the best performance in the dry when you want it.

honda606

Exactly.

It's always a learning experience. He can try the PSS now and then try the RE71R in the future. I'll never go back to a 300 after these last two sets of the RE71R.

B serious

Idk if any extreme summers will last 15-20K miles. Especially if they are staggered (I'm assuming OP's car is stock). The fronts would. The rears would not. I don't even think Z2's would last that long on the rear axle...even if you were willing to go all the way to 2/32", where there is ABSOLUTELY no rain traction left.

Realistically, you'd be looking at about a 8-10K mile life span before the tire was fairly useless in anything except dry weather. Maybe 10-15K for Z2's.

My wife's stock AP2 went through Kumho SPT's in 18 or 20K. They were down to 3/32". Mostly around town miles. One 20 min track session. And some road tripping.

As far as EP tires in the rain....rain traction is something that the RE11 and 71R do very well. Its something that Bridgestone just excels in. AD08's are also good in the rain.

The rest of the mainstream EP tires suck ass in the rain. Lets be honest. The Z2 is decent when its brand new. Then a little bit of wear later...nope.

Concerning steering response between the S04 and MPSS....I did not find that the steering response on S04's was noteably better than the MPSS. The MPSS has quite a bit less tread squirm. Maybe there's a bigger spread as the S04 starts to wear. The S04 will probably become sharper in steering response as it wears.

The fact is that not everyone wants or needs an EP tire. And the S2000 certainly doesn't need an EP tire to be fun on the street. A performance oriented max performance tire has virtually the same steering response and I highly doubt you'll need more grip. I've tracked stock S2000's on Max Perf tires and managed respecable lap times. The MPSS was nipping at the heels of Z2 SS's for short sessions. And the car came with max performance tires from the factory. They're not a downgrade...and MPSS's are better than S02's or RE050's.

EP tires aren't a necessity...and they won't "transform" a street car. They're dis-advantageous if you're not planning on tracking the car.

SlowTeg

If you don't track your car, I really don't think you'll see the benefit of EHP tires. If you do, you're probably doing something stupid on the street you shouldn't be doing in the first place. Max Performance tires are plenty for a street car. There ARE disadvantages to the EHP tires.. The big one being NOISE. I'm on my 2nd set of Z2's, and they are very loud compared to my old Sumitomo Z3's (that were decent street tires imo). They also ride harsher but the tradeoff is better steering response. Everything has tradeoffs. If you don't want to hear a drone on the highway, you might want to think twice about the EHP category.

I haven't experienced the RE71R's first hand, but people say they wear VERY quickly, and are considered the "cheater" 200TW tire that offers R-comp level grip. I'm sure they have plenty of road noise and tend to ride harsh as well. For a street car only, I don't see the point.

GSteg

Good thread so far. I'll eventually try out the Pilot Super Sport once my current Hanhook Ventus V12 wears out. Let me know how they are for daily driving.

s2000Junky

Sure they CAN, given a proper street alignment as mentioned. Problem is most people don't know what that is, or choose to camber the shit out of there car along with too much rear toe.

That's right, but unlike the PSS the S02 and Re050 are dual ply sidewall construction, more akin to an Extreme summer tire construction, which greatly enhances the control and turn in sharpness of the car. In that respect the PSS are a downgrade. Grip levels are comparable. So with that, I don't agree with your personal assessment at all. Sorry. If you want the best handling out of the car, the safest bet is to run an extreme summer. The side benefit is the added dry grip. I've never heard someone try and argue for a lessor performing tire before as the safe choice, its pretty funny actually. You will actually be safer on a tire that grips better. Your braking distances will be shortened and the overall cars behavior will inspire confidence and safe maneuverability to a higher window before traction is diminished. That's good no matter how you choose to drive the car. Get your monies worth.

If you have no self control, maybe you shouldn't be driving a sports car at all?

B serious

According to the majority of the internet, they wear out in 17 miles of highway driving or 16 miles if you look at them with a sideways mouth face :\

The actual wear is not anywhere near as bad as described. BUT...it is noteably faster than the next fastest wearing EP tire.

Z2's are the longest lasting, in my experience. I've used RS3 V1 and V2, Z1, Z2, AD08, and 71R on my personal car(s).

I bought mine in summer/fall 2015, right before ITR expo. Used them mildly at expo because it was raining and cool. I have been street driving the car with them (not counting the winter months when the car is stored). I would say I probably have like...2K street miles. They wear quick.

All EP tires ride badly. If you have a suspension that's sophisticated enough to handle them, its a little less pronounced. I would not mate them to a stock suspension or very mild street suspension without expecting some hoppyness. Z2's and 71R's are the harshest out of the bunch that I've tried.

71R's are easily as noisy/a bit more noisy than the Z2. Z2's, RS3's, and 71R's are all comparable in the noise segment.

Car Analogy

Can we leave comments like this out of the discussion? Its just inflammatory.

Lets stick to the pros and cons of Extreme vs Max Performance tires for street use, and avoid bashing each others POV. I think it would also be a good idea to just try and give the OP facts, and let him decide, and not try and tell him what to do.

If I have been guilty of any of these offenses in this thread, I apologize.

Sent from my SM-G920P using IB AutoGroup

B serious

Sure they CAN, given a proper street alignment as mentioned. Problem is most people don't know what that is, or choose to camber the shit out of there car along with too much rear toe.

That's right, but unlike the PSS the S02 and Re050 are dual ply sidewall construction, more akin to an Extreme summer tire construction, which greatly enhances the control and turn in sharpness of the car. In that respect the PSS are a downgrade. Grip levels are comparable. So with that, I don't agree with your personal assessment at all. Sorry. If you want the best handling out of the car, the safest bet is to run an extreme summer. The side benefit is the added dry grip. I've never heard someone try and argue for a lessor performing tire before as the safe choice, its pretty funny actually. You will actually be safer on a tire that grips better. Your braking distances will be shortened and the overall cars behavior will inspire confidence and safe maneuverability to a higher window before traction is diminished. That's good no matter how you choose to drive the car. Get your monies worth.

If you have no self control, maybe you shouldn't be driving a sports car at all?
[/quote]

With a stock alignment and stock suspension, I doubt you'll get 15-20k out of an EP tire. S02's and 50A's *typically* lasted less than that (unless you were willing to go to 2/32" or less).

With your argument for safety, every single car on the road should come with EP tires? Because they shorten braking and increase dry grip?

Why stop there? R compounds magnify that.

Why stop there? Slicks magnify that even further.

Just align the car so that your slicks wear slower.

Picking the right tires for a vehicle is a balancing act. OP says he's street driving his S2000...and it seems as if he wants the car to be more crisp without going overboard.

Sure, 71R's bite harder than MPSS. But that doesn't necessarily make them the right tire for his situation.

The MPSS still makes the car "safer" than the stock tires. While being a well rounded, liveable tire.

B serious

I can respect anyone's differences in opinion. But if the aim is to help someone pick the correct tire for THEIR use, I think at least laying out the facts would help.

What is this mythical EP tire that lasts 15-20K miles on a non staggered S2000? Was that just highway miles? What alignment specs were used?

In 10 years of owning a S2000...and having a second STOCK S2000 during that time..and being around all different types of people who own S2000's for all different purposes...I have never seen this. If it exists, nobody is sharing their secrets as to how they achieved their feat.

Beyond that...did the tire still work in the rain for 15-20k miles? Was this tire used on dry days in AZ under very specific highway conditions and a super secret alignment that zero'd the rear toe and removed all toe deflection from the suspension? Was it driven extra gingerly? Is there even a purpose to using an EP tire at that point?

Nobody in the EP camp wants to admit that almost every single EP tire is noisy and harsh? Maybe it doesn't bother YOU for the purpose YOU use YOUR S2000 for. But it might be worth mentioning.

Not everyone drives their S2000 to take it to the max all the time. Its a very useable, mass produced HONDA that is enjoyable under a bevy of different situations.