CutieBonny

To simply say: I could've bought a 350Z, Boxster, Z3 (Z4 wasn't out yet), Corvette, or any car under $50K (my cap budget), but in the end, I chose my S for all the right reasons. Have I said enough?

SHIRI

[QUOTE]Originally posted by greeny488
Those numbers are BS shiri.

SHIRI

[QUOTE]Originally posted by evo s2000

SHIRI

In stock form, the Z isn't necessarily faster than a S2k... keeping in mind being completely stock, no mods whatsoever. If you compare apples with apples, a vert Z and a S2000 on a drag strip or highway roll are nearly equal in performance, assuming both were driven well. Handling is no contest, the S2k would eat it up in the corners. My loud-mouth neighbor and I did back to back to back to back runs from a dead stop and rolls, vert versus vert. It either ended up in a tie, or I got a little ahead (my guess being that I had better reflexes).


Vert Z is heavier than the Coupe, shouldn't have to point out which is faster. So your neighbour SUCKS. Doesn't mean S is as fast or faster.


The hardtop admittingly should be a bit faster at much higher speeds over the S2000, but considering it packs 2 more pistons, 287hp, 274TQ, and a 1.5L advantage, the performance difference is hardly impressive considering the S2000 gives it a hard time with 40HP and 120TQ less and being a vert.


If you instigate a race or just simply race, don't cry about disadvantages. People here always like to post Z races.


Data based on numbers are factual, relative to the test conditions but the drivers themselves introduce the biggest variant with the resulting "real world" performance numbers. Since cars can't drive themselves and there's a lot of factors that we cannot control, there's going to be some exceptions to any case.


There is little skills involved in shifting from 3rd all the way to 6th and the numbers shows that the S is falling back like hell. 13 seconds at 140mph is "you can fit an aircraft carrier" lengthwise.


For the record SHIRI, I really don't care if anyone is faster than I am... I seriously don't. I can't drive around worrying about who'd hand me my ass and spend all of my $$$ into upping the power and such. The faster car isn't necessarily the better car. By what you seem to be implying, we should all ditch our S2000's and trade them in for the 350Z's. I've driven both, I like the S much better... IMO, it's closer to having total balanced performance.


Sure you don't care, but why are you still here? I've driven the S and it is boring when I test drove it around the local dealership. I need to take it on the 490 yen tollway just to get some power out of it. Sorry I prefer Zs.

SHIRI

[QUOTE]Originally posted by 3ngin33r1
350Z
3.5-liter DOHC 24-valve V6 engine
HP 287 hp @ 6,200 rpm
TQ 274 lb-ft @ 4,800 rpm
Curb Weight (lbs.) 3,189-3,239

MY04-S2000
2.2-liter DOHC 16-Valve VTEC
HP 240 @ 7800

SHIRI

My post commented about how the performance of both cars are very close, especially with the verts, and the edge going to the hardtop Z during drag style to races from rolls. Those kinds of performance results are close, but the larger differences are found in the cornering ability of both cars.


I can't remember if you're the CUT and PASTE guy, but we're talking about which is the faster car here in a straight line (read original post).


Regardless of the obvious differences of both of these cars, they cannot defy the laws of physics. A heavier car will have to deal with understeer in a greater degree than a lighter car. For example, a 200HP AE86, modified to a level similar to the 350Z/S2000 in regards to suspension, brakes, tires and such would be able to maintain more speed (more likely a higher degree of speed) while in a medium to long corner like on a track. To put this into simple and crude terms, assuming all other things being equal, the larger/heavier car won't hold it's speed in the corner versus the lighter car.


In other words, look at the ELISE, perfect example.


The size of the car also plays a role for obvious reasons. The S2000 being smaller will have more choices when it comes to choosing your driving lines in an autocross-like situation. A larger car will have less choices in regards to it's driving lines since it occupies more space on the course.


In other words, look at the ELISE, perfect example.


So what does this all mean? In a straight-line battle, power plays a very large factor to determine who wins. In a track situation, the races are won and lost in the corners. Considering the Z and the S2000 are pretty close in terms of straight line performance, the car that can exit corners with more speed will win. Even if the Z would out accelerate the S2k from a dead stop, if the S2000 exits the corner 3-5mph faster than the Z, the S2000 will be faster for every single foot of the straightaway going into the entry of the next corner. That may more than compensate for the difference in power.


I think you watch too many videos and read too much about what 1 or 2 talented S drivers have done in autoX. Firstly, they are not even close in straight line acceleration, especially after 80mph. The S's only chance are the corners, and on tight autoXes they do pretty well for small cars.


This is true for the S2000 versus the 350Z. The S although being underpowered compared to the 3.5L 350Z, it's lighter and IMO has superior suspension tuning from the factory and would be able to inch up or away from the Z in the corners, depending on its position. Again I'm only referring to completely stock vehicles, unmodded in any way with drivers of equal skill.


Being $6000 more, the S better have superior handling. The Z has great suspensions, just not designed for hardcore track racing.

3ngin33r1

Is this where the circular debate starts or did that happen 25 posts ago?

Hyper-X

[QUOTE]Originally posted by SHIRI Vert Z is heavier than the Coupe, shouldn't have to point out which is faster.

SHIRI

SHIRI, please read carefully. I never claimed the S is faster than the Z. If I beat any Z, it may've been just me or the driver of the 350, who cares. Nobody gets blown away unless someone really messes up.


But read mine first, I said "Doesn't mean S is AS FAST or faster" even if you had kept up with a SUCKY driver.


After 80mph, aero drag becomes a huge issue... surely you know this. So what if the vert is heavier, it has the wonderful VQ engine you're so proud of, with all that power and torque which the S seems to lack, it should whoop us plain and simple, but it doesn't. To be fair there's a lot of factors that contribute to the results.


Yes I already know this and it is one of the first excuse you always bring up. Like I said, don't cry about any disadvantages, and no I'm not that proud of the VQ engine, Nissan has made better engines before (which I'm sure you know something about), however the VQ is amazing for a 6 cylinder. I remember one idiot on this forum claiming that the 287 rated HP figure was probably maxed out and no additional power could be achieved. Over a year later, we can do so much to this engine, it surpassed EVERYONE's expectations. The Z does whoop you good, and as the numbers have proved, 13 seconds seperating the 2 cars is a very very very long bus.



What does this have to do with anything I said? Acknowledging the ups and downs on anything is a sign of good observation and awareness. No car is perfect, each with its unique strengths and weaknesses. Do you think that races are won purely because they are the fastest on the straightaway without regard to the opponent's advantages and disadvantages? BTW, people post stuff about Z's because it's a car worth talking about... nobody would post how they smoked a Tercel or a diesel Jetta.


Ummm.... there is absolutely nothing wrong with beating a faster car, it means that you were the faster driver on the day. However, there is a misconception that these cars are so even that the S must really be some amazing car (ie. hype). Sure its pretty fast for a 4 cylinder, but its not the fastest thing on earth. Given the power and torque the the Z has, isn't it so obvious that it is the faster car without mag racing?


What numbers? What skills? Anything a driver is required to do involves skill. If you mis-shift anywhere from 3-6 with 2 cars that perform at similar levels, you will lose.
Unless you are trying to set the land speed record in your town, I don't see how having a car taking 13 or 20 seconds to reach 140mph is meaningful.


So you're saying the test driver probably mis-shifted during that acceleration run to 140mph? Perhaps they must be extremely bias towards Hondas (which I don't think they are).
Yes, speeding to 140mph is not clever on the streets, but on the big track it is VERY IMPORTANT. I don't know how to emphasis this any further.


So what if the 350Z can reach 140mph in 3 seconds, big deal. That only means that you'll die going out of control very quickly. Most of the people here drive the S2k as their dailys, and it's their day to day speeds that matter most.


3 seconds? was that a mistype? I don't understand your point here.


I really don't care if anyone's faster than me, do you? A modified moped could take your precious Z in the first 10 feet, is that anything meaningful to care about? So you drove the S and didn't like it... good for you! Nobody's putting a gun to your head forcing you to like the S2000. BTW, the reason I'm here is because if you haven't noticed, I'm an owner of one. So the real question is... what are you doing here?


I don't care if you're slower or faster than me, and I certainly don't care if an RC can beat me in the first 10 feet. You don't like the Z for some reasons, and that's fine. I'm also entitled to share opinions of the S in the same way. Its just not for me as it doesn't have enough power down low.


Being 6k more has nothing to do with it. A BMW M3 is a lot more but doesn't have superior handling, however the M3 is still well known for its handling. The cost of anything doesn't mean it has to go towards suspension alone.


But the S was designed as an autoX car the same way as the Miata. It is not a DRAG car, nor an open track car, it is an autoX car. It may have a lacklust interior, but everything is spent on the chassis to enhance its handling ability. It is an all out roadster.
The M3 on the other hand is a 4-5 seater 2/4 door sports car! It handles pretty well for a family-like sports car, better than the Z's counterpart the G35 and probably better than a 4 door S2000 as well (if Honda ever build one).


In the Z's defense, it has a lot of good things going for it suspension wise since Nissan spent a lot of time in reinforcing the chassis' underside, using the same brakes found in the BNR34, using a unified rear strut bar to name a few, but it has its weaknesses just like any other car. For what it's worth, if I couldn't put bus lengths on a car having the displacement, power and torque advantage, I'd be sick. Imagine the S2000 having the NSX engine installed, even with a smaller displacement, it'd school the VQ equipped Z... even from 80mph which you appear to think matters most SHIRI.


Well, I believed Nissan spent a lot of time trying to rebuild the original 240z with the technology that was available to them. And believe it or not, the Z is not Nissan's fastest car, far from it. It is a sports car, and as you should know, speed isn't everything in a sports car if it can't use it properly.

Don't think that the 3.0 NSX engine is light, and don't automatically assume that the S will magically be 1-2 seconds faster. The 1989 4 Cylinder Lotus Esprit S4s did 62mph in 4.8-5.2 seconds, the 2002 V8 Lotus Esprit does it in 4.5.-4.8 seconds. NOT A BIG DIFFERENCE.

And as for being schooled by an NSX powered S, how about I put the lighter 2.6 RB TT in the Z?

SHIRI

Yes it does seemed so.

HyperX and I have been discussing since the dawn of man apparently.