STR Prep - Suspension and Alignment
#82
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Location: Frankfort, KY
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I'll just stay lurking in the back ground waiting for the results
I do agree that of you can learn to drive a ap1 s2000 at the limit you can get in any car and be able to drive it "well"
I have yet to get in a car that give me as much of a rush as my str s2000 when driving at the limit. The brakes on a porshe carrera gt did scare the crap put of me though. I honestly felt like I was going to get thrown thru the windshield.
I do agree that of you can learn to drive a ap1 s2000 at the limit you can get in any car and be able to drive it "well"
I have yet to get in a car that give me as much of a rush as my str s2000 when driving at the limit. The brakes on a porshe carrera gt did scare the crap put of me though. I honestly felt like I was going to get thrown thru the windshield.
#83
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Originally Posted by nmrado' timestamp='1326605042' post='21318214
[quote name='rrthorne8' timestamp='1326500176' post='21315426']
but i have some questions on the spc upper offset ball joints, has anyone else noticed that they are taller then the oem ones?
isnt this almost the opposite of what a roll center adjuster is supposed to fix?
what effects on handling may have taken place by essentially spacing the front or rear upper ball joint?
what affect does this have on the rules>
but i have some questions on the spc upper offset ball joints, has anyone else noticed that they are taller then the oem ones?
isnt this almost the opposite of what a roll center adjuster is supposed to fix?
what effects on handling may have taken place by essentially spacing the front or rear upper ball joint?
what affect does this have on the rules>
So, because the SPC assemblies keep the ball joint - spindle relationship the same in the vertical direction, they are legal. The overall assembly dimensions don't dictate motion...just wheel clearance. Make sense?
[/quote]
Originally Posted by rrthorne8' timestamp='1326673294' post='21319707
what i am saying is that it appears that the SPC ball joint is in fact vertically taller then oem. i do understand the difference between camber and roll center
#84
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#86
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One additional data point that I believe is important along the curve is when the rear control arm is level. This would be when inner and outboard connection points are equal in height assuming the car chassis is level. I think this will be the point where the dynamic toe curve (slope or derivative) switches from toe out to toe in (changes sign) during compression. The opposite effect will occur during rebound.
Assuming this slope change occurs (hypothesis right now) you can then decide where on the overall toe curve you would like to operate by setting your ride height accordingly. I think if the control arm is slanted down from inner to outboard point there will be toe out on initial turn in during compression followed by toe in once past this point. If your ride height is low enough for the control arm to be slanted upward when at rest then only toe in would be experienced during compression. We'll let the data tell us what reality is. I also thing this point will be different for AP1 vs AP2, where on the curve the slope change is relative to the location in the compression/rebound stroke.
Also note that your springs, sway bars and shocks will control how much of the curve is used (traversed) for any given dynamic course situation. Higher spring/sway bar rates and shock damping will reduce how much of the curve is used. It could be that with a soft less controlled suspension the rear will be more "lively" because more of the curve is used.
So for anyone making the measurement please note on the curve where the rear control arm is level. Also note AP1 or AP2 along with year. We should be able to see if there is both toe out and toe in on the curve based on the shape.
Personally I don't care what the actual values of toe are through this toe curve. The only value of toe I care about is for alignment purposes. All the points on the curve are relative to the static alignment point and you cannot change (adjust) the curve. You can only change where on the curve you operate.
I may pull my right rear shock this weekend and try to capture the curve.
#87
I agree that we really just need to understand the dynamic characteristics of the rear toe.
One additional data point that I believe is important along the curve is when the rear control arm is level. This would be when inner and outboard connection points are e[media]http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3156/5702937556_ffc2306aa0.jpg[/media]qual in height assuming the car chassis is level. I think this will be the point where the dynamic toe curve (slope or derivative) switches from toe out to toe in (changes sign) during compression. The opposite effect will occur during rebound.
One additional data point that I believe is important along the curve is when the rear control arm is level. This would be when inner and outboard connection points are e[media]http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3156/5702937556_ffc2306aa0.jpg[/media]qual in height assuming the car chassis is level. I think this will be the point where the dynamic toe curve (slope or derivative) switches from toe out to toe in (changes sign) during compression. The opposite effect will occur during rebound.
My kingdom for a toe curve! I mean, look at this thing. Axis everywhere.
#88
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by Random1' timestamp='1327678054' post='21357984
I agree that we really just need to understand the dynamic characteristics of the rear toe.
One additional data point that I believe is important along the curve is when the rear control arm is level. This would be when inner and outboard connection points are e[media]http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3156/5702937556_ffc2306aa0.jpg[/media]qual in height assuming the car chassis is level. I think this will be the point where the dynamic toe curve (slope or derivative) switches from toe out to toe in (changes sign) during compression. The opposite effect will occur during rebound.
My kingdom for a toe curve! I mean, look at this thing. Axis everywhere.
#89
I'm betting that in the range of motion we use, we will see only toe-in on compression and only toe-out under extension. The interesting part will be if that range of toe is more or less dramatic at different ride heights.
#90
Personally I don't care what the actual values of toe are through this toe curve. The only value of toe I care about is for alignment purposes. All the points on the curve are relative to the static alignment point and you cannot change (adjust) the curve. You can only change where on the curve you operate.