Preparation for first track day
12-18-2008 | 11:45 PM
#51
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From: Pico Rivera
Originally Posted by 124Spider,Dec 18 2008, 09:45 PM
Every time you preach the "gospel" of oem pads, I'll demur.
It's fine for the first one or two events for a novice. But, after that, it is taking a chance at compromised brakes, for absolutely no good reason (save 30 minutes of prep time to compromise brake performance? Nonsense...). At most tracks, it's downright stupid; there may be tracks where it's not depraved, but there's absolutely no good reason to compromise safety for so little "gain" at any track.
It's fine for the first one or two events for a novice. But, after that, it is taking a chance at compromised brakes, for absolutely no good reason (save 30 minutes of prep time to compromise brake performance? Nonsense...). At most tracks, it's downright stupid; there may be tracks where it's not depraved, but there's absolutely no good reason to compromise safety for so little "gain" at any track.
12-19-2008 | 12:00 AM
#52
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From: Covington WA, USA
Jaku, I've never been to SoW, but it certainly doesn't appear to be a high speed track. What experience have you had with your OEM pads on tracks where you are dropping from 130 into third gear corners, or 100 into second gear corners?
For example, a typical lap for me at Pacific Raceways has four big braking zones: 125->65, 100->35 (downhill!), 100->65, and 90->50. This happens every 1:45. Stock brake pads won't cut it; no way, no how.
For example, a typical lap for me at Pacific Raceways has four big braking zones: 125->65, 100->35 (downhill!), 100->65, and 90->50. This happens every 1:45. Stock brake pads won't cut it; no way, no how.
12-19-2008 | 03:53 AM
#53
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From: Honda HQ
Originally Posted by Jaku,Dec 18 2008, 10:52 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_uuSkM3CLE
OEM tires + OEM pads
there is no such thing as minimum mods for a track day, learn how to drive stock first!
OEM tires + OEM pads
there is no such thing as minimum mods for a track day, learn how to drive stock first!
Point is we're giving advice to newbies about prepping for the track. I've personally experienced what stock pads can do, and I would NOT recommend it to ppl for their first time. If there's one thing that's important especially when new to tracking is consistency, and stock pads don't give you that. I'm experienced enough to drive around fading brakes, but newbies aren't. It can be frustrating, and scary. What fun do you think it is going out for each session knowing that the brakes will start to crap out after a few laps?
12-19-2008 | 09:56 AM
#54
Joined: Apr 2004
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From: Redmond, Washington, USA
Originally Posted by bellwilliam,Dec 19 2008, 12:32 AM
tow truck won't take [the tire trailer].
12-19-2008 | 10:01 AM
#55
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From: Redmond, Washington, USA
Originally Posted by Jaku,Dec 19 2008, 12:45 AM
for people like you use so much brakes on oem tires, what can I say?
Jaku, the simple fact is that using OEM pads, once one has achieved a certain proficiency on the track, is suboptimal. Regardless of the tires or the track. While one can make the case that learning on street tires is a good thing, learning on OEM pads adds nothing to one's knowledge base (well, except what it feels like to have brake fade; not a good thing), while compromising safety (both yours and that of those sharing the track with you).
12-20-2008 | 12:32 AM
#56
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From: Pico Rivera
Originally Posted by mikegarrison,Dec 19 2008, 01:00 AM
Jaku, I've never been to SoW, but it certainly doesn't appear to be a high speed track. What experience have you had with your OEM pads on tracks where you are dropping from 130 into third gear corners, or 100 into second gear corners?
For example, a typical lap for me at Pacific Raceways has four big braking zones: 125->65, 100->35 (downhill!), 100->65, and 90->50. This happens every 1:45. Stock brake pads won't cut it; no way, no how.
For example, a typical lap for me at Pacific Raceways has four big braking zones: 125->65, 100->35 (downhill!), 100->65, and 90->50. This happens every 1:45. Stock brake pads won't cut it; no way, no how.
at SOW, it's 95->35, 73->45, 61->38, 77->42, 102->75->42, 62->37
those are just my stock top speed and corner speed from my datalogger (1st money i spend for my car
), i know people can brake more than they need it!these 2 tracks certainly don't need brakes as much as you need it at Pacific Raceway!
12-20-2008 | 05:45 AM
#57
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From: Hinesville
Originally Posted by subtledreamer,Dec 7 2008, 06:26 PM
Hey guys,
Couple specific questions in preparing for my upcoming (and first) track event on December 22nd @ Buttonwillow.
I bought a set of AP1 wheels (for cheap), hoping to use them as track wheels because 1) I don't want to change out tires on my current AP2 wheels each time I go to autocross/track as I am running & intend to run tires that are enough for the street but not for track, 2) 16" tires are easier on the wallet, and 3) not able to invest, nor see the need in purchasing a set of lightweight, forged 17's yet.
Now, I've searched and read a few threads on tire selection and like the Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Sizes.jsp?ma...rt+Z1+Star+Spec). However, the biggest size available for 16" seem to max out at 225 width for the rear and 205 for front. Now I know these are OEM sizes for the AP1, but was wondering if that would be wide enough for the track. Should I go with a different brand/model of tire with wider sizes, or stick with the Z1's?
I am not 100% certain how I will tow the wheels & tires to Buttonwillow, but am considering getting a tire trailer (ex: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Disp...temnumber=90153) since my car already has a hitch installed for my bike rack. It is rated for 200 lbs (IIRC), and since a trailer would simply be pulled along the road, I have read that as long as 10-15% of the total weight of the trailer does not exceed the max load on the hitch, I will be fine. So will my bike rack hitch be adequate for a job like this?
If it helps to throw it into the equation... my AP2 is stock with the exception of KW V3 coilovers.
And as a checklist for other things... I will do these before the event:
- alignment
- check all fluid levels and top off as necessary
- bring tire pressure gauge, pump, and other car tools
Thanks in advance guys.
Couple specific questions in preparing for my upcoming (and first) track event on December 22nd @ Buttonwillow.
I bought a set of AP1 wheels (for cheap), hoping to use them as track wheels because 1) I don't want to change out tires on my current AP2 wheels each time I go to autocross/track as I am running & intend to run tires that are enough for the street but not for track, 2) 16" tires are easier on the wallet, and 3) not able to invest, nor see the need in purchasing a set of lightweight, forged 17's yet.
Now, I've searched and read a few threads on tire selection and like the Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Sizes.jsp?ma...rt+Z1+Star+Spec). However, the biggest size available for 16" seem to max out at 225 width for the rear and 205 for front. Now I know these are OEM sizes for the AP1, but was wondering if that would be wide enough for the track. Should I go with a different brand/model of tire with wider sizes, or stick with the Z1's?
I am not 100% certain how I will tow the wheels & tires to Buttonwillow, but am considering getting a tire trailer (ex: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Disp...temnumber=90153) since my car already has a hitch installed for my bike rack. It is rated for 200 lbs (IIRC), and since a trailer would simply be pulled along the road, I have read that as long as 10-15% of the total weight of the trailer does not exceed the max load on the hitch, I will be fine. So will my bike rack hitch be adequate for a job like this?
If it helps to throw it into the equation... my AP2 is stock with the exception of KW V3 coilovers.
And as a checklist for other things... I will do these before the event:
- alignment
- check all fluid levels and top off as necessary
- bring tire pressure gauge, pump, and other car tools
Thanks in advance guys.
12-20-2008 | 09:24 AM
#58
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,571
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From: Redmond, Washington, USA
Originally Posted by geoffrey06,Dec 20 2008, 06:45 AM
I don't know if anyone has told you about this, but when you are parked in between runs don't use your e-brake. You need to bring a block of wood or something to put under the tire while in pit or you can risk warping your rotors if you get them hot enough.
And using the parking brakes with very hot rotors doesn't risk warping the rotors so much as you likely will transfer pad material onto the rotors, thick enough that it could cause bad pulsing on braking (same symptom as the extremely rare warped rotor, but different cause).
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