sfphinkterMC

yes i (you?) can up and downshift all gears in an S without clutch

it is not as easy as many previous cars i have done this, probably due to tighter Honda tolerances, or i don't know

i thought it saved wear on clutch and is fun, but i now believe it is bad for synchros. its fun until you get it wrong and go GRIND! arrrgghhh!!

technique: downshift: apply slight pressure on shift lever then add precise blip to rev match, and allow lever to fall into gear

upshift: breath throttle to rev match and apply pressure to slot in gear.

But, this car prefers you use clutch, it even responds favorably to double clutching, try that for more thrills

Asura

So double clutch upshift or downshift?

No one mentioned granny shifting or the 'money' shift.

Rafal

How it could be bad for synchros if you do not even need them?
And as far as upshifts they're quicker with a clutch.

Jason Saini

Quick upshifts are not possible without the clutch... and clutchless upshifts can accelerate synchro wear. I say CAN becuase if done perfectly, they will not even use the synchro. If too much pressure is put on the shift lever too soon, the synchros will wear faster than if the clutch is used.

On downshifts, there is less wear to pretty much every component in the trans. However, as some have alluded to - there is a possibility of missing the gear, so it's much more consistent to use the clutch.

Someone else mentioned Formula cars, those are dog-ring engagement boxes and the clutch is simply not necessary in them.

Bottom line, it's ok for street use, and will save clutch wear and potentially save on synchro wear if done right. But for track driving, upshifts are too slow and downshifts too inconsistent to be the method of choice.

Rafal

Jason, exactly my feelings about the topic. I was hoping though to learn clutchless downshifts well enough to be able to use them on a track. In normal driving it's just my laziness to stop using clutch. :-)

cthree

What he said but it's not fast, in fact it's really slow and unkind to the synchros.

stocky

IF done PERFECTLY evrytime it won't use teh syncors...but WHO is able to to taht.

So you must have worn out many syncjros before until one can do it perfectly

Nobody

Just thought of something--full throttle upshifts could be done at the exact same moment the rev limiter kicked in. Not only would you avoid having to use the clutch, your right foot could remain planted on the floor.

jasonw

Wouldn't the tranny need the RPMs to be @ 6,000 RPMS by the time the clutch was out?

cthree

The real question is why you would want to do it. Because it's "cool"? What do you gain other than risk without reward?