Canton pan thoughts here
06-24-2015, 08:04 AM
#351
Originally Posted by davidc1' timestamp='1435116186' post='23658324
[quote name='beechx1' timestamp='1434989605' post='23656132']
I have a friend with an AP1 who put the Canton pan in his car two seasons ago. He took the factory tray out when he installed the Canton pan. He claims that there is less oil in his catch can during track days after replacing the stock pan (no baffles) with the Canton pan. So apparently there is not a lot of foaming.
I have a friend with an AP1 who put the Canton pan in his car two seasons ago. He took the factory tray out when he installed the Canton pan. He claims that there is less oil in his catch can during track days after replacing the stock pan (no baffles) with the Canton pan. So apparently there is not a lot of foaming.
[/quote]
Agreed. Of which there really isn't much in the pan.
And, to sort of correct myself, a lot of the oil that gets in our catch cans is liquid that gets trapped in the valve cover and sucked through the hoses into the intake.
06-24-2015, 08:29 AM
#352
Originally Posted by yamahaSHO' timestamp='1435160710' post='23658855
[quote name='davidc1' timestamp='1435160122' post='23658844']
[quote name='yamahaSHO' timestamp='1435156876' post='23658765']
[quote name='davidc1' timestamp='1435116047' post='23658320']
[quote name='yamahaSHO' timestamp='1434939418' post='23655620']
Installed the Moroso trap door baffle and left in the stock tray. After looking at the tray in person, I wouldn't want to remove it as it does channel the oil to fall around the pickup.
[quote name='yamahaSHO' timestamp='1435156876' post='23658765']
[quote name='davidc1' timestamp='1435116047' post='23658320']
[quote name='yamahaSHO' timestamp='1434939418' post='23655620']
Installed the Moroso trap door baffle and left in the stock tray. After looking at the tray in person, I wouldn't want to remove it as it does channel the oil to fall around the pickup.
Again, I don't give a crap what Honda calls it.
And... There are two distinct holes for oil to drain out of that tray and they are placed near the pickup. Unless you have such mad acceleration that you're able to get the oil to go up and over the rear step, the majority of the oil only has those two holes to pass through. Doubt all you want, but physics cares not.
[/quote]
Don't get your panties in a bunch, I wasn't trying to be confrontational with you. Sorry if it seemed that way.
I mentioned what Honda calls it, so that if somebody looked it up on a parts list and they'll know what we are referring to.
So, are you saying that when that windage tray is mounted, the only place in the oil on top of it has to get through to the pan are the two holes? That no oil can go over the front back or sides of it?
[/quote]
Read the bold text.
[/quote]
Okay yeah I missed qualifying word in your post. So I guess I just don't agree with you. The car is bouncing around so much in about six different axis, that I really don't think the majority of oil goes to those two holes.
[/quote]
The tray slopes down toward the two holes. Yes, oil will be moving, however, that tray is trying to direct the oil to the pickup. The largest opening is in the rear and is also stepped. Most S2000's are likely not making all the oil slosh backwards. The tray seals off pretty well on the sides, so there's only so many routes that oil is actually going to take to get back to the pan. Doesn't matter if you agree with it.
Originally Posted by yamahaSHO' timestamp='1435156957' post='23658767
[quote name='davidc1' timestamp='1435116186' post='23658324']
[quote name='beechx1' timestamp='1434989605' post='23656132']
I have a friend with an AP1 who put the Canton pan in his car two seasons ago. He took the factory tray out when he installed the Canton pan. He claims that there is less oil in his catch can during track days after replacing the stock pan (no baffles) with the Canton pan. So apparently there is not a lot of foaming.
[quote name='beechx1' timestamp='1434989605' post='23656132']
I have a friend with an AP1 who put the Canton pan in his car two seasons ago. He took the factory tray out when he installed the Canton pan. He claims that there is less oil in his catch can during track days after replacing the stock pan (no baffles) with the Canton pan. So apparently there is not a lot of foaming.
[/quote]
Agreed. Of which there really isn't much in the pan.
And, to sort of correct myself, a lot of the oil that gets in our catch cans is liquid that gets trapped in the valve cover and sucked through the hoses into the intake.
[/quote]
The pan is a large source of oil and with all the sloshing around, oil will find itself becoming mixed into the air. If you control how much the oil is allowed to slosh, you'll likely have less of it mixing in the air and the rest of the crankcase gases.
06-25-2015, 06:00 AM
#353
Originally Posted by davidc1' timestamp='1435161271' post='23658867
[quote name='yamahaSHO' timestamp='1435160710' post='23658855']
[quote name='davidc1' timestamp='1435160122' post='23658844']
[quote name='yamahaSHO' timestamp='1435156876' post='23658765']
[quote name='davidc1' timestamp='1435116047' post='23658320']
[quote name='yamahaSHO' timestamp='1434939418' post='23655620']
Installed the Moroso trap door baffle and left in the stock tray. After looking at the tray in person, I wouldn't want to remove it as it does channel the oil to fall around the pickup.
[quote name='davidc1' timestamp='1435160122' post='23658844']
[quote name='yamahaSHO' timestamp='1435156876' post='23658765']
[quote name='davidc1' timestamp='1435116047' post='23658320']
[quote name='yamahaSHO' timestamp='1434939418' post='23655620']
Installed the Moroso trap door baffle and left in the stock tray. After looking at the tray in person, I wouldn't want to remove it as it does channel the oil to fall around the pickup.
Again, I don't give a crap what Honda calls it.
And... There are two distinct holes for oil to drain out of that tray and they are placed near the pickup. Unless you have such mad acceleration that you're able to get the oil to go up and over the rear step, the majority of the oil only has those two holes to pass through. Doubt all you want, but physics cares not.
[/quote]
Don't get your panties in a bunch, I wasn't trying to be confrontational with you. Sorry if it seemed that way.
I mentioned what Honda calls it, so that if somebody looked it up on a parts list and they'll know what we are referring to.
So, are you saying that when that windage tray is mounted, the only place in the oil on top of it has to get through to the pan are the two holes? That no oil can go over the front back or sides of it?
[/quote]
Read the bold text.
[/quote]
Okay yeah I missed qualifying word in your post. So I guess I just don't agree with you. The car is bouncing around so much in about six different axis, that I really don't think the majority of oil goes to those two holes.
[/quote]
The tray slopes down toward the two holes. Yes, oil will be moving, however, that tray is trying to direct the oil to the pickup. The largest opening is in the rear and is also stepped. Most S2000's are likely not making all the oil slosh backwards. The tray seals off pretty well on the sides, so there's only so many routes that oil is actually going to take to get back to the pan. Doesn't matter if you agree with it.
Originally Posted by yamahaSHO' timestamp='1435156957' post='23658767
[quote name='davidc1' timestamp='1435116186' post='23658324']
[quote name='beechx1' timestamp='1434989605' post='23656132']
I have a friend with an AP1 who put the Canton pan in his car two seasons ago. He took the factory tray out when he installed the Canton pan. He claims that there is less oil in his catch can during track days after replacing the stock pan (no baffles) with the Canton pan. So apparently there is not a lot of foaming.
[quote name='beechx1' timestamp='1434989605' post='23656132']
I have a friend with an AP1 who put the Canton pan in his car two seasons ago. He took the factory tray out when he installed the Canton pan. He claims that there is less oil in his catch can during track days after replacing the stock pan (no baffles) with the Canton pan. So apparently there is not a lot of foaming.
[/quote]
Agreed. Of which there really isn't much in the pan.
And, to sort of correct myself, a lot of the oil that gets in our catch cans is liquid that gets trapped in the valve cover and sucked through the hoses into the intake.
[/quote]
The pan is a large source of oil and with all the sloshing around, oil will find itself becoming mixed into the air. If you control how much the oil is allowed to slosh, you'll likely have less of it mixing in the air and the rest of the crankcase gases.
[/quote]
While oil does slosh around in the pan and could theoretically contribute to the amount that ends up in a catch can, I think it's probably negiigable in our engine. This is evidenced by the fact that in 10 yrs of reading this forum, you are the only person I can recall pushing that theory several times.
And you are absolutely correct that it doesn't matter if I don't agree with you. And, if you don't care if I agree with you or not, my guess is you won't care enough about what I say to try to refute me anymore, huh?
06-25-2015, 07:20 AM
#354
I have never pushed this theory. I just explained what can be contributing to the experience several people have had after putting in this Canton pan... I believe I have also read that someone here also had the same experience with the Moroso weld-in baffle. It's so "negiigable" that people are noting the change in oil vapor found in their cans, especially AP1 owners.
I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you. I am looking at how things operate and do not care what you think, regardless of 10 years of reading a forum.
I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you. I am looking at how things operate and do not care what you think, regardless of 10 years of reading a forum.
06-25-2015, 07:45 AM
#355
I have never pushed this theory. I just explained what can be contributing to the experience several people have had after putting in this Canton pan... I believe I have also read that someone here also had the same experience with the Moroso weld-in baffle. It's so "negiigable" that people are noting the change in oil vapor found in their cans, especially AP1 owners.
I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you. I am looking at how things operate and do not care what you think, regardless of 10 years of reading a forum.
I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you. I am looking at how things operate and do not care what you think, regardless of 10 years of reading a forum.
06-29-2015, 10:15 AM
#356
Anyway, lol...I have some info from this past track weekend.
Ambient Temp: Low 70's deg F
WHP: 205
Track Oil temp: 260-270 deg F throughout 20-25 minute sessions
Highway/Street Oil temp: 175-200 deg F
Measurement Device: PLX fluid sensor and DM-100
This is with out an aftermarket oil-to-air cooler. Everyone I talked to at the track said anything under 300F is acceptable for synthetic oil. This lines up with what I can find on the interwebs. Extrapolate this to 100+ deg F track day and oil temps may approach 300 if not more. I couldn't take a before measurement but SlowTeg did:
I don't know anything about his car, but if it's similar power to mine, this supports the speculation that oil temp increases a measurable amount with this pan despite oil capacity increase.
Also, I had to add a 4th flywheel spacer, which is the max amount due to space constraints.
P.S. David, I didn't drain my oil into a clean drain pan so I didn't want to reuse it.
Ambient Temp: Low 70's deg F
WHP: 205
Track Oil temp: 260-270 deg F throughout 20-25 minute sessions
Highway/Street Oil temp: 175-200 deg F
Measurement Device: PLX fluid sensor and DM-100
This is with out an aftermarket oil-to-air cooler. Everyone I talked to at the track said anything under 300F is acceptable for synthetic oil. This lines up with what I can find on the interwebs. Extrapolate this to 100+ deg F track day and oil temps may approach 300 if not more. I couldn't take a before measurement but SlowTeg did:
Also, I had to add a 4th flywheel spacer, which is the max amount due to space constraints.
P.S. David, I didn't drain my oil into a clean drain pan so I didn't want to reuse it.
06-29-2015, 11:14 AM
#357
Putzing on the street oil temps don't drop on the highway with the canton pan. With the OEM pan I'd see temps hit 170F or less cruising on the highway in the summer. In the winter, they'd get in the 150's even or less. With the canton pan they get upto ~200F and hover around there. The OEM pan definitely aids in cooling. One look at it when removing it it becomes abundantly clear that Honda designed it that way.
