Ultralight

What in God's name was the SEB thinking, putting the 2004 S2000 in AS? The car is heavier than older models and has no more horsepower. How can they move it up without some proof that it is faster than the 00-03 models? None have raced in a divisional or national tour event yet. When the 1.8 liter Miata came out, it was higher horsepower than the 1.6 but it stayed in the same class as the 1.6 for a few years until it was proven to be slightly faster. The 99+ Miatas are still classed with the 94-97 models and the 99+s are significantly faster. There is a huge gap in performance in DS between the Integra-R and the WRX but they are left in the same class. The 04 S2000s are not even faster than the 00-03s on paper as the rev limiter is set 800 RPM lower on the 04 and they are heavier too Even interpolating from the 2003 nationals times is no indication that the 04 S2000 could be competitive in AS because of the rain during BSs run of the south course and ASs run of the north course. I've emailed SCCA. What else can we do about it?

CoralDoc

This has been the subject of a lengthy discussion in this thread.

Be careful, if you don't voice the complaint correctly we might wind up with all S2000s in AS for 2005.

payneinthe

There is enough data to indicate it could be faster. Would you rather they risk upsetting the apple cart in BS? They can always reclass the 04 later if they need to. And please don't go getting the 00-03s bumped up too. I guess misery loves company...

Ultralight

Thanks for the link Coraldoc.

In 10 years of following the classification of new cars, putting the 04 S2K into AS was the most arbitrary I have seen. I bought an 04 based on the SEBs tradition of placing a new car in its logical class until it was proven faster.

PedalFaster

Read Coraldoc's link and the threads linked from it carefully. This was very far from an arbitrary decision, and you do the members of the SAC an injustice by suggesting otherwise.

Steve

Gregg Lee

As you may have noticed in earlier threads, I've mentioned the same thing, and that it pushes the classification rule pretty hard on defining a new model. I was surprised they did it too, but I'm beginning to lean toward this approach at least at times. If there is doubt, AND there is a large number of earlier cars already running, then put the new car in a higher class until actual performance data is available, to protect the people who are already running the older models.

BUT, this assumes that SCAC/SEB is actually willing to use the 12 month rule to move the car down if performance says it's not a problem, and that the new car's trial classification is not perceived to be so penal that none show up. Probably OK for 04 S2000 in AS, but the next problem will be the C6 Corvette, then the Z06 C6. ASP initially? Or BSP with Stock preparation rules? Turbo Miata, SS? 05 Mustang, AS or SS? I'm not sure this makes the problem easier.


A point not previously mentioned on the 04 S2000, is that assuming handling is more or less equal to the earlier cars, it will be clearly superior on Pro Solo courses, where the launch and drag (the single greatest weakness of the 00-03) are critical, and where the courses are tight enough to require 1st gear downshifts by the 00-03, but top speeds will rarely require a shift to third by either car. Of course the SCAC isn't suppose to consider Pro Solo in classing, given its course design quirks, and since Pro can modify Solo II rules as it chooses. But I'll bet someone on Nat'l Staff is glad they don't have make the call separately.

Gregg


[QUOTE]
Ultralight
In 10 years of following the classification of new cars, putting the 04 S2K into AS was the most arbitrary I have seen.

PoweredByCamry

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ultralight
Thanks for the link Coraldoc.

In 10 years of following the classification of new cars, putting the 04 S2K into AS was the most arbitrary I have seen.

shaggy

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ultralight In 10 years of following the classification of new cars, putting the 04 S2K into AS was the most arbitrary I have seen.

kenlola

Did I miss something, was the 04 definitely moved to A stock. I autocrossed my 04 today 1/12/04 and nobody said anything about it being reclassified. I thought they are just looking for member input as of now. By the way, I raced my stock 04 with an alignment and street tires. The car handles really good now with controllable oversteer and is very stable. There was only one other s2000 there and he beat me by about .4 sec on a 43 second course. His car was an 00, stock but with victoracers.

Ken

shaggy

The '04 is definitely classed in A Stock. It is published in the February Fast Track which is available now online.