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CheapER suspension? Worth it?

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Old 05-21-2013 | 08:12 PM
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Default CheapER suspension? Worth it?

I want to get some coilovers and sway bars and tighten things up. Right now my suspension is stock with s-tech springs and I think they're too soft, the body rolls a lot more than I would like in hard cornering. I'm only willing to spend around 1,500 in total with the sway bars, but have read that the cheaper stuff is going to be worse than the stock suspension. Could anyone confirm or deny this with personal experience? Would I be better off getting some coilovers for 1000, or quality shocks and spring rates to match? Just trying to get the most performance for my money.
Old 05-21-2013 | 08:17 PM
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Waste of money to cheap out on suspension.
anything under 1500 is going to be a downgrade in performance/ride quality over stock...but it will look cooler.
Save up and dont buy the same part twice.
A quality suspension set up WILL net you more happiness than cheap coilovers and sway bars.
I went from Buddyclub n+ to KW Clubsports,...the car went from being a 2004 to being brand new again.
Old 05-21-2013 | 08:21 PM
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Bilstein pss9 I hear is really nice
Old 05-21-2013 | 08:29 PM
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Yeah, I was thinking of the PSS9's since I hear about them all the time, but anyone have experience with them VS stock? Like sillyboybmxer said, I've been reading cheaper suspension is a waste, and i'd rather spend more, but buy it once.
Old 05-21-2013 | 08:34 PM
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Almost any coilover around the $1000 mark is better than stock. Numerous people attest to it, numerous tests attest to it. Lower CG and stiffer dampening cannot be worse than stock body roll.

https://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/102...-on-the-s2000/

The cheapy ~$1000 setup in there was 5 SECONDS FASTER than stock. The CR has tons of highly engineered aero, so it doesn't count.

I'd say any of the 1000-1500 suspension setups will get you better performance (maybe ride quality goes down, but who hits bumps and who cares? This car is made for track). The more expensive setups will perform better, but IMO the sweet spot for diminishing returns is around $2k, with KWv3 being a good example of not spending 1/2 the car's value on shocks for really minor gains.
Old 05-21-2013 | 09:05 PM
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I am currently looking at these:

Bilstein pss9
pss

Tein Flex

KW Varient 1

Buddy Club N+
Old 05-21-2013 | 10:08 PM
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Don't forget buddyclub racing spec.

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Old 05-22-2013 | 08:46 AM
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Was looking really hard for buddy club n+ since there are a bunch of deals on here. Spoke to a friend who is running N+ and he said he should have just spent the extra money for the racing specs, but from what I looked up, the only differences between the two are higher spring rates, and pillow ball mounts on the racing spec. Which makes me think I'd be better off with the bilsteins pss9, pss , or ground control which just use koni yellows and eibach springs. Both of which can be re-built if I ever want to get a stiffer spring or change my set up in the future.
Old 05-22-2013 | 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by s2kreeper
Almost any coilover around the $1000 mark is better than stock. Numerous people attest to it, numerous tests attest to it. Lower CG and stiffer dampening cannot be worse than stock body roll.

https://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/102...-on-the-s2000/

The cheapy ~$1000 setup in there was 5 SECONDS FASTER than stock. The CR has tons of highly engineered aero, so it doesn't count.

I'd say any of the 1000-1500 suspension setups will get you better performance (maybe ride quality goes down, but who hits bumps and who cares? This car is made for track). The more expensive setups will perform better, but IMO the sweet spot for diminishing returns is around $2k, with KWv3 being a good example of not spending 1/2 the car's value on shocks for really minor gains.
I've got to disagree with this recommendation on multiple levels...

First, shock absorbers damp chassis and suspension component motion. If you dampen something, you make it wet. Our shocks are viscous dampers and produce damping forces. You'll notice that many manufacturers talk about "32-way dampening" or "insanely awesome extreme dampening". This is proof that they are a low-end manufacturer and don't have the personnel to write an accurate description of their products. 32-way damping doesn't exist. They're probably talking about a single-adjustment damper with 32 levels of adjustment that probably don't have a great range of adjustment or adjust the wrong characteristics of the damper.

The article linked above is highly misleading and does a very poor job controlling variables. Reread it and consider how many differences there are between the cars. All it shows is that cars with varying parts/pieces will result in different lap times. The only variable controlled was the tire compound. Look at the dyno results... look at the aero variation... AP1/AP2 variation... drivers weren't allowed to alter the damping adjustments... One of the cars was admittedly damaged/tweaked! I say this every time someone posts that damn article, but it's garbage as a comparison.

If a $1000 coilover system yields a 5 second improvement... on say a 1 min 45 sec track... there is something wrong with the original setup or the driver is inexperienced. The stock suspension is very capable when you get the balance to a point where it's confidence inspiring. Body roll isn't problematic with the double a-arm suspension design that the S2k uses. You don't lose significant tire contact patch as the body rolls because each corner gains a significant amount of negative camber as it compresses. Low roll stiffness hurts you in a quick transition sections where you end up having to wait for the weight to transfer before you can take an aggressive set into the corner. With smooth driving inputs it's possible to turn some quick lap times on a chassis that uses the stock springs & dampers.

Spend that $1000 on track time, auto-x events, professional instruction and you'll be much more capable of controlling your vehicle as is. As you get more in tune with the chassis, you'll be able to determine why you like a certain feature or why you dislike a certain characteristic of your S2000's suspension. Then you'll have the knowledge to make positive changes. Getting chassis balance right doesn't require coilovers. The right tires/wheels, adequate damping and the proper selection of anti-roll bars will yield a chassis that can be driven quickly...if piloted by an experienced driver.

/rant
Old 05-23-2013 | 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by nmrado
Originally Posted by s2kreeper' timestamp='1369193689' post='22558700
Almost any coilover around the $1000 mark is better than stock. Numerous people attest to it, numerous tests attest to it. Lower CG and stiffer dampening cannot be worse than stock body roll.

https://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/102...-on-the-s2000/

The cheapy ~$1000 setup in there was 5 SECONDS FASTER than stock. The CR has tons of highly engineered aero, so it doesn't count.

I'd say any of the 1000-1500 suspension setups will get you better performance (maybe ride quality goes down, but who hits bumps and who cares? This car is made for track). The more expensive setups will perform better, but IMO the sweet spot for diminishing returns is around $2k, with KWv3 being a good example of not spending 1/2 the car's value on shocks for really minor gains.
I've got to disagree with this recommendation on multiple levels...

First, shock absorbers damp chassis and suspension component motion. If you dampen something, you make it wet. Our shocks are viscous dampers and produce damping forces. You'll notice that many manufacturers talk about "32-way dampening" or "insanely awesome extreme dampening". This is proof that they are a low-end manufacturer and don't have the personnel to write an accurate description of their products. 32-way damping doesn't exist. They're probably talking about a single-adjustment damper with 32 levels of adjustment that probably don't have a great range of adjustment or adjust the wrong characteristics of the damper.

The article linked above is highly misleading and does a very poor job controlling variables. Reread it and consider how many differences there are between the cars. All it shows is that cars with varying parts/pieces will result in different lap times. The only variable controlled was the tire compound. Look at the dyno results... look at the aero variation... AP1/AP2 variation... drivers weren't allowed to alter the damping adjustments... One of the cars was admittedly damaged/tweaked! I say this every time someone posts that damn article, but it's garbage as a comparison.

If a $1000 coilover system yields a 5 second improvement... on say a 1 min 45 sec track... there is something wrong with the original setup or the driver is inexperienced. The stock suspension is very capable when you get the balance to a point where it's confidence inspiring. Body roll isn't problematic with the double a-arm suspension design that the S2k uses. You don't lose significant tire contact patch as the body rolls because each corner gains a significant amount of negative camber as it compresses. Low roll stiffness hurts you in a quick transition sections where you end up having to wait for the weight to transfer before you can take an aggressive set into the corner. With smooth driving inputs it's possible to turn some quick lap times on a chassis that uses the stock springs & dampers.

Spend that $1000 on track time, auto-x events, professional instruction and you'll be much more capable of controlling your vehicle as is. As you get more in tune with the chassis, you'll be able to determine why you like a certain feature or why you dislike a certain characteristic of your S2000's suspension. Then you'll have the knowledge to make positive changes. Getting chassis balance right doesn't require coilovers. The right tires/wheels, adequate damping and the proper selection of anti-roll bars will yield a chassis that can be driven quickly...if piloted by an experienced driver.

/rant
Thank you sir. Everything that needed to be said, but most people, including myself, were to lazy to write.



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