rocketstarter

Everything else is not a waste of money. Nobody has saved you money or frustration. I also don't understand where this rumor is coming from but this chassis is not too distant from tarmac to utilize a rear diffuser, especially if equipped with aftermarket suspension.

There's more to downforce then a tall wing. If you're not limited by a rule book then you should be utilizing both.

A tall wing will outshine a diffuser on braking stability if both are run seperate. But a properly set up diffuser will give you a better base for getting the most out of your wing.

A diffuser on our cars should be set for 7-8 degrees to negate the effects of drag and generate the most downforce, depending if a wing is being utilized and how close to the rear the wing sits. Front opening needs to be a few inches wider then rear to accelerate channeling air, as it enters from the front and sides of the car [enter Bernoulli's Principle]. The smoother the underbody the faster the air will channel, which will create a low pressure in the rear from a SMOOTH transition into the diffusers upsweep and thus changing it's momentum through a vertical component. The channel should be closed off from the wheels to prevent air flow disturbance.

All much like the J's Racing diffuser.

Exhaust gases can be used as well to accelerate the air by mechanical means, but that would result in incosistent grip, though it would be a nice addition in high speed FT corners.

See, you can't write it off as a 'waste of money' and a 'proper wing' is not the only way to generate downforce. It doesn't have to be frustrating, as long as you have adjustments to make you can always see what works best for your application on your home track by the means of calculating your lap times and section times.

Also don't forget that a rear wing will increase your cd, which is the trade-off for better rear grip. On a daily driver I'd much rather make a diffuser for my application then have a tall wing. The amount of 6th gear miles I accrue is much greater then the amount of corners I take on a daily basis.

rocketstarter

Playing around with a toy is more enjoyable then shopping for one. Here's a good read for you to see how everything developed over time http://www.mhest.com/spotlight/autom...rodynamics.pdf

robrob

Quote:

On a daily driver I'd much rather make a diffuser for my application then have a tall wing. The amount of 6th gear miles I accrue is much greater then the amount of corners I take on a daily basis.

There's no way a car at daily driver height (speed bumps, curbs, potholes) can generate enough downforce with a diffuser to make it worth the extra weight. But the chicks dig them

rocketstarter

Only if your daily driver is setup to drive over curbs

sparrow

smh smh smh... we're not talking about a groundup racecar or a car deisgned from scratch... we are talking about the s2000. Dollar for dollar for items that can be purchased ots he will have 10X at minimum the benefit from a wing as opposed to a diffuser. If you can find a diffuser for $600 that will be more beneficial than an apr gtc-200 I'd be first in line.

Even if you wanted to go ahead and buy a j's/ts/pwjdm diffuser I would still place bets on a wing of equivalent value. Now if you want to discuss the merits of a proper venturi tunnel design as it relates to cd and negative lift that is entirely different subject matter b/c the s2000's design is not conducive to a design that can fully utilize these principles. Furthermore the distance between diffuser and airfoil would be too great for the airfoil to truly benefit. Furthermore the OP lacks sufficient knowledge to even begin to design his own diffuser. So where exactly you are going to save him money and frustration all the while providing him more downforce than an ots wing I, robrob and I'm sure others would like to know. No srsly this is not an attack I would rly like to know. Got my snickers ready.

OTS wing/spare trunk = $1k and 1hr install time

//steve\\

Now my question is when is it time for a wing? Should I have reached a certain point in skill before I even attempt to try adding a wing or toss one on as soon as I can pay for it?

robrob

I would say when you can consistently and automatically catch the rear end as it begins to step out you are ready for a wing (same for r-compound tires). The BSR wet skid pad works wonders for learning the proper automatic reaction.

Put on a wing too early and you may end up losing the rear end at a higher speed and smack something hard enough to make you cry. I wouldn't be in too much of a hurry though, the better you get without a wing the better you'll be when you finally do slap one on.

rocketstarter

Ots none of the diffusers you see on the s2000s will produce any positive effects, their price is outrageous, and people still buy them because they look good. The J's racing looks promising but until I test it in CAD I can't say anything other then its shape is promising and that it might be worth about $150 for the effect it'll generate.

If you were that interested in saving the OP money you'd recommend a 255 up front instead of a 225 before purchasing another trunk and a wing as we can all agree that front tire width and tire compound here will make the biggest difference in lap time shaved per dollar.

For occasionally going to the track I wouldn't recommend anybody a wing or a diffuser. But for a road car I'd rather have a diffuser then a wing [If I frequent the track often enough to squeeze the last milisecond out of my alignment and tires then of course I'd realy on a wing] If I have to buy my friends at nasa cases of beer for CAD help [maybe even tunnell if I get them drunk enough ] then so be it as it's extremely enjoyable. I'll report my findings on here and put everybody to sleep, then we'll see exactly how useful/useless a diffuser on our cars is.


No I cannot save the OP any money if he's not interested to acquire the knowledge needed for such a design, and no the wing won't save the OP any money either if he rarely tracks the car ...on 225 fronts. But these designs are a very intriguing subject because their function on our cars is questionable, whereas a wing is proven performance.

In OPs case the verdict is not a diffuser or wing, but wider front tires, and stickier tires overall.

sparrow

robrob

Okay, that dancing dude is really creeping me out and I'm talking like clown makeup creepy. . .