2011 Track Junkie Thread
05-20-2011, 06:29 AM
#1291
Originally Posted by FF2Skip' timestamp='1305778561' post='20591040
Wow, George! Those Sebring shots are old. 
Thanks a bunch!
Lou, Ron, Pete, George, Alison, Rob, Matt, Calvin, Mani, Cale, Jim, Barrie, Keith, David, Oleg, the BMW guys(Scott, Joey, Mike,), the TT guys that paddocked next to us(mostly at SP) and countless others that I'm forgetting(and feel badly about it), THANK YOU for making my weekends at the track all the more memorable. Yes, I always wanted to 'win" or do well, but in the end I've realized, truly appreciated, what it meant to have all of you around during the day, but even moreso at day's end when we all grin and reflect on how lucky we all were/are to have done and are doing something that so few people do in their lifetimes: we have lived. We have pushed ourselves. We have experienced that rush and been able to talk about it with others who do understand.
Cliche' I know, but we don't fully appreciate what we have until it's gone. Felt that way when I lost my dad in '04. Felt that gravity of what we do when Cale was taken from us and the possibility of it happening again when the STi guy flipped beyond the wall the very next year in T1 at SP. And now.
August 10 would've made 9 years owning PrincesS, her only owner. Thank you, PrincesS and all those that I have come in contact with through my ownership. Your impact in my life may never be truly conveyed to you, but make no mistake, the mark is more permanent than any ink or tattoo. More lasting than time itself.
Thank you again.
Thanks a bunch!Lou, Ron, Pete, George, Alison, Rob, Matt, Calvin, Mani, Cale, Jim, Barrie, Keith, David, Oleg, the BMW guys(Scott, Joey, Mike,), the TT guys that paddocked next to us(mostly at SP) and countless others that I'm forgetting(and feel badly about it), THANK YOU for making my weekends at the track all the more memorable. Yes, I always wanted to 'win" or do well, but in the end I've realized, truly appreciated, what it meant to have all of you around during the day, but even moreso at day's end when we all grin and reflect on how lucky we all were/are to have done and are doing something that so few people do in their lifetimes: we have lived. We have pushed ourselves. We have experienced that rush and been able to talk about it with others who do understand.
Cliche' I know, but we don't fully appreciate what we have until it's gone. Felt that way when I lost my dad in '04. Felt that gravity of what we do when Cale was taken from us and the possibility of it happening again when the STi guy flipped beyond the wall the very next year in T1 at SP. And now.
August 10 would've made 9 years owning PrincesS, her only owner. Thank you, PrincesS and all those that I have come in contact with through my ownership. Your impact in my life may never be truly conveyed to you, but make no mistake, the mark is more permanent than any ink or tattoo. More lasting than time itself.
Thank you again.
If I remember right don't you live in Manassas? I am right down the street in Bristow so if you ever wanna take a S2000 for a ride all you gotta do is ask. Although it is not quite on par with PrincesS (read: stock), it is still fun.
Good luck.
My car isn't even close to being track ready (few more problems such as a tie rod end being bad.. and possibly a bump stop on one of my new Clubsports being messed up... gggggrrrrr btw haha). but once I get a chance to start coming out more you are more than welcome to drive as well as share any sort of hotel or trailer/camper type room i might get in the years to come 
I hope you'll still come out to meets though, you're presence at pub dog or old meets new or any others is always a highlight of my trip to them
05-20-2011, 06:47 AM
#1292
Former Moderator
I've been doing some research on differentials and found a really great article with fantastic animations on how a differential works. Here's the link: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/differential.htm
This is the important paragraph about the S2000's Torsen differential:
It's a great differential as long as you don't lift a rear wheel.
The OS Giken is a clutch type Limited Slip Differential.
This is the important paragraph about the S2000's Torsen differential:
However, if one set of wheels loses traction completely, the Torsen differential will be unable to supply any torque to the other set of wheels. The bias ratio determines how much torque can be transferred, and five times zero is zero.
The OS Giken is a clutch type Limited Slip Differential.
05-20-2011, 06:55 AM
#1293
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Gods Speed #57 Lemons #77
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I've been doing some research on differentials and found a really great article with fantastic animations on how a differential works. Here's the link: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/differential.htm
This is the important paragraph about the S2000's Torsen differential:
It's a great differential as long as you don't lift a rear wheel.
The OS Giken is a clutch type Limited Slip Differential.
This is the important paragraph about the S2000's Torsen differential:
However, if one set of wheels loses traction completely, the Torsen differential will be unable to supply any torque to the other set of wheels. The bias ratio determines how much torque can be transferred, and five times zero is zero.
The OS Giken is a clutch type Limited Slip Differential.
That is one reason that autxers are limited by the torsen diff. I lift rear wheel at every autoX I attend, it feels like the car just stops.
If you start running monster stiff spring rates, you will make the situation worse. I think if you run much more than 600lb in the rear, a torsen diff is no longer going to realy work well for you.
05-20-2011, 07:11 AM
#1294
Former Moderator
Pete, I thought the rear wheel lift was caused by the rear sway bar--in a turn the outside spring compresses and the sway bar compresses the inside spring and lifts the rear inside wheel. How would stiffer springs make it worse? It seems that stiffer springs all around would reduce body roll and reduce the rear sway bar's effect.
05-20-2011, 07:17 AM
#1295
Join Date: Jan 2003
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Pete, I thought the rear wheel lift was caused by the rear sway bar--in a turn the outside spring compresses and the sway bar compresses the inside spring and lifts the rear inside wheel. How would stiffer springs make it worse? It seems that stiffer springs all around would reduce body roll and reduce the rear sway bar's effect.
It is both a roll bar issue and a spring rate issue. Stiffer spring rate = less roll. With less roll you either slide or the car starts lifting wheels. Allowing some body role can help prevent wheel lift and removing the rear sway bar can help with this (but not what I would recommend). Same thing with sway bar.
The standard torsen diff becomes a liability in competition with fast drivers. Sticky tires make this issue even worse.
05-20-2011, 07:34 AM
#1296
What about a gear type like Quaife? I have heard a lot of good things about them and they offer lifetime warranty.
EDIT However for some reason their warranty has an exclusion if the differential was bought in or used in U.S/Canada/Mexico
That sucks.
EDIT However for some reason their warranty has an exclusion if the differential was bought in or used in U.S/Canada/Mexico
That sucks.
05-20-2011, 08:12 AM
#1297
05-20-2011, 08:52 AM
#1298
Former Moderator
Pete, I still don't see how stiffer springs would make inside rear wheel lift worse. Stiffer spring rate = less roll = less rear sway bar force lifting the inside rear wheel.
05-20-2011, 11:54 AM
#1299
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Drive around in a circle. Go faster and faster. At some point the inside rear tire lifts. Stiffer spring do not help with this.
Simply put, sticky tire will allow you to lift a rear tire. Most autoxers use 275/40 Hoosier A6 in the rear and tire lift is a fact of life.
There is no combination of springs (whatever the rate) or swaybar (or lack of swaybar) that prevents this. If you are cornering hard enough the rear wheel lifts. Period.
The OEM torsen LSD becomes as useless as an open diff once a tire lifts, other types still retain some function.
05-20-2011, 01:23 PM
#1300
Registered User
Can't say one way or another, but my experience changing spring rates slowly, adjusting comp/rebound on shocks, and disconnecting the rear anti-sway bar leads me to this: disconnecting the rear ASB definitely helps reduce inside wheel lift, but makes turn-in feel like an Olds 88. To compensate for the loss in the rear, one would conceivable increase spring rates.
Reducing compression and rebound helps with traction in less-than-optimum conditions such as r@!n. We all know that. Lessening the two can give you a little bit of roll compared to setting them stiffer/faster. In the end, it would seem logical(that all I have to go on because I have forgotten most of the suspension stuff I read in a book) that the most efficient way to control rear wheel lift would be to disconnect the rear anti-sway bar and use stiffer springs.
Case study: Matt(9kI4) and I decided to change things up a bit. He normally ran with the rear bar disconnected; me with it connected. We reversed. He connected his; I disconnected mine. That lasted one session. His car became very twitchy and mine seemed to resemble something from John Deere.
My suggestion is based on NOT replacing the OEM type diff.
Reducing compression and rebound helps with traction in less-than-optimum conditions such as r@!n. We all know that. Lessening the two can give you a little bit of roll compared to setting them stiffer/faster. In the end, it would seem logical(that all I have to go on because I have forgotten most of the suspension stuff I read in a book) that the most efficient way to control rear wheel lift would be to disconnect the rear anti-sway bar and use stiffer springs.
Case study: Matt(9kI4) and I decided to change things up a bit. He normally ran with the rear bar disconnected; me with it connected. We reversed. He connected his; I disconnected mine. That lasted one session. His car became very twitchy and mine seemed to resemble something from John Deere.
My suggestion is based on NOT replacing the OEM type diff.