steve c

? Acura is a division of Honda.

I don't buy it. You don't build a luxury car and not focus on the top tier,

Yours is a unique experience then. Browse the Legend / LS400 boards, there are a myriad of common problems. Not that issues should be considered unusual with 10+ year old cars. I love my 93 LS400, but in many ways it is a heap of shit, albeit a good looking heap of shit.

The Civic is priced higher than the competition, the Camry beats the Accord in sales, Honda killed the Prelude, offers us an NSX essentially unchanged for 13 years for 90k and has nothing in the RWD luxury, real SUV or truck class. I'd say the reality is very different from your perception.

Not this year. Japanese sales are down across the board.

Look around then. SH failures were very common for auto-x and track cars, to the point where folks swapped out the system with a cheaper and more robust Quaife unit.

hpark

definitely a step in the right direction....now bring the V-8 powered RWD Type S version

Ckcrigger

NOT AGAIN!!

vananron

I own an S4 and an 04' E500 7 speed auto, let me tell you, I used to think that torque was overrated. But not on luxury sedans. I will tell you that I have had ZERO problems with either car. The only thing I do notice is the respect that I get with the benz that I have never been able to get. Mostly based on age. But I do like the RL, but if I am spending that much, on a car, that is supposed to be luxury, then I want low end GRUNT. I have ran an "off-idle" launch in the benz, and it ran 14.1 on street tires, that is with Traction control ON. So it is faster, and comes with WAY more gadgets, plus it holds status. And as for the nay sayers, I have had NOT one problem with either car, and the dealership treats you like royalty.

dbjb

Acura sales, however, are up.


BMW and Chrys...err Mercedes do not make a superior product. That is a fact. Check reliability ratings and speak with professionals in the business (like MB techs, BMW techs, body shop managers, etc) they will all say the same thing.

With the new RL, I dont think it will be cut and dry anymore with regards to the MB, Bimmer, Audi, and Lexus being any better.

rai

[QUOTE=vananron,Sep 23 2004, 01:15 PM] I own an S4 and an 04' E500 7 speed auto, let me tell you, I used to think that torque was overrated.

VTEC Racer

Wow, I didn't think I would have to go into a depth explanation for this when I said that, but apparently you need it. I thought when I mentioned Infiniti my point would have been made even more obvious. Okay.... Honda and Acura are one company. Nissan and Infiniti are one company. However, Honda is still owned by Honda where as Nissan is not 100% owned by Nissan anymore. Theres a difference there. Honda and Acura have remained independent companies. I wonder whats been helping Honda do this, couldn't be their cars, right?

I don't care what you buy. Acura themselves have announced the RL's main competition and focus. Do I need to list the cars again? Again, like Acura has already said, they didn't build the RL to compete with the top cars. In reality, they built a car that they new would bring in a large amount of profit to further strengthen their independence as a company.

The Civic is priced higher than the competition? Were you not the one that was recently arguing that people would be willing to pay slightly more for a whole lot more car? The only reason why the Camry outsells the Accord on paper is because the Camry has three different models in reality. There is the Camry sedan, Camry Solora Coupe and the Camry Solora Convertible. Toyota adds the sales of all three of those cars and puts it under "camry sales". If you compare the amount of Camry sedans sold to Accord sedans, you will see that the Accord outsells the Camry. Honda killed the Prelude because the type of people who were interested in the Prelude couldn't justify the extra cost over the GS-R. It created in company competition. Yes the NSX has been around since 1990, but what was Mercedes, BMW or Lexus offering for that market at that time (NSX was less than $90k at debut). Like I said, Honda has nothing in the RWD luxury department because thats not what they are after, as they have said themselves. Honda has a niche in the winter weather sales. If they swapped there cars to RWD, they would lose sales from people who need FWD or AWD for winter driving. Adding AWD to the RL is the perfect combination to meet the needs of both types of consumers. Whether you think the MDX is a real SUV or not, it doesn't really matter when it's tied with the Lexus RX330 for best-selling SUV.

Check this out for Japanese sales: http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=249054

SH failures couldn't have been as common as you say if I had never even heard of one during my time of extreme frequenting to the Prelude forums. I have heard of people getting the Quaife unit, but only for increased performance, not because of ATTS failures.

steve c

Sure they do, better is a subjective term of course. Have you driven them? I find it interesting that a few of us here have these big sedans; none of us have an RL.

Where? Please provide a reference.

Large amount of profit? Have you looked at the RL sales numbers .. or the NSX sales numbers? Where do you get off telling us how much profit is in the RL in the first place? Do you have the cost breakdown, if so please share.

The problem is, the civic is no longer better than cheaper cars.

Toyota adds the sales of all three of those cars and puts it under "camry sales".
Wait, you mean like there is a Honda Accord and Honda Accord coupe ...please that is the lamest attempt at rationalizing I have ever read. Toyota sells more cars because they build a better product. Economics 101.

No, they killed the car because no one purchased them.

Newsflash, BMW Mercedes and Lexus have never built a competitor to the NSX. I don't understand your attempted correlation here.

So now you work for Honda marketing? Many of us prefer RWD cars for winter driving, with traction control systems these days it is often a mute point which pair of wheels is driven.

Neither is a real SUV, but that is not relevant to this conversation in the first place.

My guess is you never paid attention; saying you are not aware of the issue does not make it go away.

mav

Uh no.

BMW 5 Series > Acura RL

cacophony82

steve c:





I like the concept and i think the car will do okay. ALMOST seems like a nitch car like the nsx and exotic made by the japan....in this case a prem lux sedan made by.....

Great car but i wouldn't spend 50,000 on one if i was in that income bracket. That doesn't mean someone who does is wrong, but everyones gotta buy what they like




just my 02


justin