Porsche: Giving one back to the true enthusiasts
11-11-2009, 03:38 AM
#41
Originally Posted by NuncoStr8,Nov 10 2009, 08:28 PM
You want a car precisely between a Lotus Elise and a Boxster.
And logic says if the performance and ride quality goals lie somewhere between, it'll have to cost ~50K.
That would've resulted in a lighter-weight and significantly *cheaper* car.
Would it have sales between 5K and 20K when every buyer can choose more performance or a better ride for the same money? And precisely where in that range would sales lie? You'd need to know that as a manufacturer before you can predict what kind of money could be safely invested in that project.
That's a daunting prospect for any manufacturer. I'm not surprised there are no takers.
Interestingly, I read that their new owners, VW, are FAR more interested in the opposite, getting rid of the giant vehicles and developing smaller/lighterweight SPORTS CARS again. So I am cautiously optimistic about Porsche's future, now that people who understand the brand and what it means better than they themselves did are going to be running the show.
As much as you want to believe less weight means less cost, you ought to know that's a load of BS in the real world. There is so much more to it than "adding lightness."
If you want a car to be lightweight, it has to be designed into the development from the outset. After the fact, when you have built yourself a 6-cylinder base Boxster that weighs very nearly 3000 lb., it is too freaking late. You resort to extreme measures like removing the roof, radio, and AC, and designing custom low-volume parts to end up with a "special" toy model that STILL weighs over 2800 lb.
Light weight, done RIGHT, designed in from the outset (with concessions, of course! Like "settling" for a 4cylinder instead of going with a 6), is generally CHEAPER. If you plot cost vs. weight for every car in the U.S. market, you'll see a VERY strong correlation. Lower cost => lighter weight, lighter-weight => lower cost. With some cheap/heavy and lightweight/expensive outliers, of course!
11-11-2009, 06:23 AM
#42
Moderator
Now that VW owns Porsche I fully expect to see a baby Porsche added to the lineup that is shared with a VW roadster - its like history repeating itself. Maybe $30-35k for the VW and $35-40k for the Porsche?
11-11-2009, 07:54 AM
#43
Originally Posted by Saki GT,Nov 11 2009, 10:23 AM
Now that VW owns Porsche I fully expect to see a baby Porsche added to the lineup that is shared with a VW roadster - its like history repeating itself. Maybe $30-35k for the VW and $35-40k for the Porsche?
It'll be a sad day when Porsche gets a sports car badge engineered with VW.
11-11-2009, 08:21 AM
#44
Originally Posted by GinoGT,Nov 11 2009, 08:54 AM
This is what will probably happen with that Blusport concept.
It'll be a sad day when Porsche gets a sports car badge engineered with VW.
It'll be a sad day when Porsche gets a sports car badge engineered with VW.
In any case, I think that the days that Porsche introduced a 5000 lb. SUV and a 4000 lb. luxo-sedan were infinitely sadder than the potential day they give us an actual lightweight/economical SPORTS CAR, even if it's a rebadged Vdub.
11-11-2009, 09:50 AM
#45
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Note the revised PDK with proper flappy paddles.
My $0.02 is mixed- I like the idea, not a fan of the execution. The humpback looks aren't exactly working for my eye, and as someone who prefers some DD usability in my sportscars, it's a lot of cheese for a pure toy.
ZDan, between the MX-5 and the various Lotus offerings your lightweight market segment is covered. Pick one of these and let the rest of the automotive would build different cars for the people who want them.
My $0.02 is mixed- I like the idea, not a fan of the execution. The humpback looks aren't exactly working for my eye, and as someone who prefers some DD usability in my sportscars, it's a lot of cheese for a pure toy.
ZDan, between the MX-5 and the various Lotus offerings your lightweight market segment is covered. Pick one of these and let the rest of the automotive would build different cars for the people who want them.
11-11-2009, 01:39 PM
#46
There is PLENTY of room in the market for a ~2500 lb. sports car that is more utilitarian than the Lotus and higher-performance than the Miata.
Meanwhile, I'll continue to drive the S2000, which isn't all that bad
Meanwhile, I'll continue to drive the S2000, which isn't all that bad
11-11-2009, 05:32 PM
#48
momentum racer? Kenneth, it's a pretty darn fast car, you're going to really have to slack off on the straights if you want to drive it like a Miata!
ZDan - light, fast, cheap: pick your choice of 2 out of those 3 traits.
ZDan - light, fast, cheap: pick your choice of 2 out of those 3 traits.
11-11-2009, 05:47 PM
#49
I'll take light and cheap. I'll *make* it fast myself >
Infinitely easier to add power than to subtract weight.
Infinitely easier to add power than to subtract weight.
11-11-2009, 05:57 PM
#50
Originally Posted by ZDan,Nov 11 2009, 08:47 PM
I'll take light and cheap. I'll *make* it fast myself >
Infinitely easier to add power than to subtract weight.
Infinitely easier to add power than to subtract weight.