OnStar... actually useful.
10-23-2009, 09:00 AM
#41
Originally Posted by tapout2000,Oct 22 2009, 04:29 PM
This is total violation of our civil liberties. I'm just sayin.
I don't see it as a violation of civil rights. It's hard to understand which civil rights you could even be talking about.
10-23-2009, 09:11 AM
#42
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I was kind of just making that statement for conversation sake to see if anybody felt that way. This could also get in to state and federal property rights... no point. Just sayin. It's another watchful big brother eye on us. Which is fine if I have a stolen car but maybe not if I accidentally mis-shift and bend a valve or something. I'm just sayin.
10-23-2009, 09:25 AM
#43
Originally Posted by tapout2000,Oct 23 2009, 12:11 PM
I was kind of just making that statement for conversation sake to see if anybody felt that way. This could also get in to state and federal property rights... no point. Just sayin. It's another watchful big brother eye on us. Which is fine if I have a stolen car but maybe not if I accidentally mis-shift and bend a valve or something. I'm just sayin.
So, I don't see in this instance there was a loss of civil rights, but I do see this creeping encroachment on personal freedoms bit by bit, bringing benefits along with the negatives.
@ Hennessey CTS V
10-26-2009, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by NuncoStr8,Oct 26 2009, 03:10 PM
driving may not seem like a right where you live, but in many places it's the only way to get anywhere. Like, to work or school or whatever. It's one thing to keep harping that driving is a privilege when you live somewhere that a taxi, train, or bus is moments away, but much of the nation lives in communities without public transportation and many of those people can't afford to live near their workplace or school.
Where did this idea that driving in America is a privilege come from, anyway? In the USA at least, all rights are in the possession of the people, and it is only with common agreement that any such rights are willingly curtailed for public safety. Our Constitution doesn't grant us the right to speak freely, it serves to guarantee that right. There is a difference. All behaviors not expressly covered by law are considered to be free and legal, not the other way around. Our government doesn't grant freedoms, it serves to ensure they are not infringed.
At no point is any activity a "privilege." Some behaviors are addressed by law, and as such are subject to restrictions. For example, at no point could sex be considered a privilege granted by law, despite laws concerning such behavior. Driving a car is no different. There are laws concerning such activity, but it's not a privilege granted by the benevolent government.
Seems to me a lot of people could do with a bit of remedial education regarding the very ideals democratic societies are based on. Hell, part of the motivation of the French Revolution was to eliminate that concept of privilege - the idea that behavior was subject first to a state authority, to be permitted subject to conditions. Instead, the idea was that all behaviors are allowed except those specifically addressed by restrictions based on mutual agreement, applying to all people equally.
I'm not too worried about OnStar turning into a government control system, because as has been said, it is a system based on subscriber fees. And I don't plan on voting for anyone who supports that kind of idea. Either way, I can always cover my car in tinfoil
Where did this idea that driving in America is a privilege come from, anyway? In the USA at least, all rights are in the possession of the people, and it is only with common agreement that any such rights are willingly curtailed for public safety. Our Constitution doesn't grant us the right to speak freely, it serves to guarantee that right. There is a difference. All behaviors not expressly covered by law are considered to be free and legal, not the other way around. Our government doesn't grant freedoms, it serves to ensure they are not infringed.
At no point is any activity a "privilege." Some behaviors are addressed by law, and as such are subject to restrictions. For example, at no point could sex be considered a privilege granted by law, despite laws concerning such behavior. Driving a car is no different. There are laws concerning such activity, but it's not a privilege granted by the benevolent government.
Seems to me a lot of people could do with a bit of remedial education regarding the very ideals democratic societies are based on. Hell, part of the motivation of the French Revolution was to eliminate that concept of privilege - the idea that behavior was subject first to a state authority, to be permitted subject to conditions. Instead, the idea was that all behaviors are allowed except those specifically addressed by restrictions based on mutual agreement, applying to all people equally.
I'm not too worried about OnStar turning into a government control system, because as has been said, it is a system based on subscriber fees. And I don't plan on voting for anyone who supports that kind of idea. Either way, I can always cover my car in tinfoil
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