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09-10-2003, 07:22 PM
#113
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I'm going to push your buttons a little Chris, you'll have to excuse me 
My post did seem pretty offensive to lower torquey cars, sorry for that. Of course, anyone would agree with you that the cars you mentioned are indeed sports cars!
Now the thing is, more displacement = more weight and most likely a larger vehicle
Then you have to modify the chassis, suspension etc etc to compensate. If there were no limits then we would all be driving Formula One Hummers, which doesn't really make sense from a practical and economical point of view
Efficiency!!!!
My post did seem pretty offensive to lower torquey cars, sorry for that. Of course, anyone would agree with you that the cars you mentioned are indeed sports cars!
Now the thing is, more displacement = more weight and most likely a larger vehicle
Then you have to modify the chassis, suspension etc etc to compensate. If there were no limits then we would all be driving Formula One Hummers, which doesn't really make sense from a practical and economical point of view
Efficiency!!!!
Originally posted by Chris S
I can't see the obsession w/ HP/liter on the street, b/c there are no restrictions on displacement.
I can't see the obsession w/ HP/liter on the street, b/c there are no restrictions on displacement.
09-10-2003, 07:29 PM
#114
Actually, the Z06's engine is really light...only ~100 lbs. more than the S2000's IIRC. Those pushrods are a lot lighter and more compact than OHC's!
If a light engine is most important to you, a Mazda rotary is calling your name...
If a light engine is most important to you, a Mazda rotary is calling your name...
09-11-2003, 05:16 AM
#115
Let's just agree that the Z06 LS6 motor is supreme to all motors on the planet. though I like my LS1 motor too.
Anyway, I think this new derivative of the F20C will be a good motor and will permit Honda to capture a larger audience, an audience that was a bit turned off with the lack of torque (though I disagree!) at low rpms.
I have a Pontiac Vibe GT as a daily driver and that 2ZZ motor has okay torque at low rpm to motor around town, but if you floor the gas at low rpm, you're going to have to wait a little while for it to spin up past 6k where the big cam comes online and gives you a good push to 8200rpm. Anyway, my whole point in rambling is after driving a few of my friend's S2000s, the S2000 has very nice low end torque really. It's just a dramatic surge difference between the low and high rpm cams, that people (meaning magazine writers and Porsche Boxster owners) think the lower rpm has a dearth of torque...
Anyway, I can't wait to drive a new '04 and feel the difference..
though I like my LS1 motor too. Anyway, I think this new derivative of the F20C will be a good motor and will permit Honda to capture a larger audience, an audience that was a bit turned off with the lack of torque (though I disagree!) at low rpms.
I have a Pontiac Vibe GT as a daily driver and that 2ZZ motor has okay torque at low rpm to motor around town, but if you floor the gas at low rpm, you're going to have to wait a little while for it to spin up past 6k where the big cam comes online and gives you a good push to 8200rpm. Anyway, my whole point in rambling is after driving a few of my friend's S2000s, the S2000 has very nice low end torque really. It's just a dramatic surge difference between the low and high rpm cams, that people (meaning magazine writers and Porsche Boxster owners) think the lower rpm has a dearth of torque...
Anyway, I can't wait to drive a new '04 and feel the difference..
09-11-2003, 06:25 AM
#116
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alfredo_mancho, i-VTEC does not take away hp from any part of the rev range. It just feels like it because the valve timing portion of VTEC is no longer induced at one point, instead it is changed throughout the rev range.
Once you get to modding, i-VTEC can be a hinderance though because valve timing can only be adjusted a little bit. Hence, Toda's Spec B and Spec C cams will mostly likely take away the "i".
Just a little FYI.
Once you get to modding, i-VTEC can be a hinderance though because valve timing can only be adjusted a little bit. Hence, Toda's Spec B and Spec C cams will mostly likely take away the "i".
Just a little FYI.
09-11-2003, 06:41 AM
#119
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I should clerify myself...i-VTEC up to really agressive cams, is a huge help. Just look at the great gains, these guys are getting off mild cams and i-VTEC tuning and fuel/air ratio modifying through Hondata. But from what I've seen or heard from the RSX boards, once you get to big cams, you just cant adjust valve timing that much to go with the big lift and big duration. However, Hytech claims that i-VTEC is a big help even with their big cams even though Toda says its a hinderance. So maybe it isnt a big hinderance, but I think it COULD be.
Also, we are unclear whether the 2.2 has i-VTEC. I do not think it does however. I can also foresee, the 2.2 responding better to mods, particularly if they used the same bolt-on parts (minus the tips for the exhaust), in typical honda fashion- the Accord 3.0 making 200 hp and the CL type S 3.2 making 260 used the same headers, resulting in great gains by getting headers for the CL type S. I hope we see some of the same for the S2200.
Also, we are unclear whether the 2.2 has i-VTEC. I do not think it does however. I can also foresee, the 2.2 responding better to mods, particularly if they used the same bolt-on parts (minus the tips for the exhaust), in typical honda fashion- the Accord 3.0 making 200 hp and the CL type S 3.2 making 260 used the same headers, resulting in great gains by getting headers for the CL type S. I hope we see some of the same for the S2200.
09-11-2003, 07:33 AM
#120
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Originally posted by TurboVtk
a modified one yes. and it ends here stop deviating from the thread topic
a modified one yes. and it ends here stop deviating from the thread topic
I'm sure with just cams, valve springs, throttle body, and the plethora of modifications Spoon makes to the motor it *CAN* produce more hp, with or without the higher revs.Anyhow, despite the motor's possible limitations due to the lack of high-revs, it may simply have more potential due to the size of the motor. Reprogramming the stock ECU, valve springs, and WA LAAA, higher revs. Then there's the question of the motor continuing to produce hp up to 9k or 10k, or wherever you want it to.