Chris Stack

Thanks....I think. I really dragged that analogy out of my ass, I'm FAAAAAR from an IT geek. Hell, I bought a mac because it was too hard keeping the spyware and viruses off my PC.

IheartS2ks

He's saying that its "internal".

A "Driver" controls an object or objects within an operating system (Windows). So for example, you have a printer right? Well you can hook it up to your computer, but it won't work without a "Driver" driving (running) it.

The printer has no bearing on the computer; if you turn the printer off, nothing will happen to the computer.

If you turn off the "printer driver" on the computer OFF, the printer will not work. The computer no longer recognizes the printer even though the printer might be on and connected.

How this relates to black boxes, well, the system can be set up many ways, but it looks like Chris is saying that it could be overridden or turned off by the ECU and not the device itself.

Chris Stack

I knew that analogy wouldn't work.

I wasn't referring JUST to the printer driver, I was referring to ALL drivers.

Instead of computers, let's try a car analogy:

The black box isn't like a trailer, that you can unhook from your car, and then keep driving with it. It's more like the engine; you won't be able to run "just your car" but not the engine.

IOW, it's going to be integrated into the car, not an add-on, so to eliminate it, you may have to replace the ECU entirely. My guess is that that will become illegal.

IheartS2ks

Got it.


So, in addition are you saying that, the car won't run, if the black box is tampered with or turned off through the ECU; that it is or will be a necessary part to make the car run?


I think the computer analogy kinda works, but instead of drivers, you'd use BIOS.

I'll stop before I confuse more people, including myself.

Chris Stack

I'm not saying ANYTHING definitively, because I just don't know. I just mean that I'm almost positive that these data recorders aren't add-ons, they are an integrated part of the ECU, so you can't turn it off separatly from the ECU. Kinda like I can't turn the clock off in my computer, but keep the computer running.

marthafokker

What he is really saying is... we don't know without having hackers reverse Engineer each manufactor's design.

And Software hacking is what it is going to take to find out how to bypass this system. Think of it like Satelitte TV hacking... and you know who you are... )

At this point, some are thinking replacing the whole ECU (most logical)... but who knows what else without the design specs.

s2kpdx01

Most logical if you hate your warranty and don't want to pass emissions and don't like your fancy PCM/TC/etc and don't like your throttle by wire......

no_really

really what you are talking about are memory registers that store certain values for a certain time. it can be as basic as the highest speed since the last reset, and/or the speed and throttle position over the last 2 minutes. There is no feasible way to "turn it off," but it takes a conscious act to read it back or reset it. It would not be beyond the realm of possibility to have an aftermarket chip/device that resets the memory registers, but getting it to do so every time the car is shut off or in the event of airbag deployment would be slightly more complicated than making it do so every time the car is started.

I have no doubt that every manufacturer has implemented such a data logging ability in radically different ways, so what works for one car or make won't work on anything else.

What would make me see such a thing favorably would be if it would funtion like certain aftermarket tachs do, with a playback function. You could conceivably play back the data for the last lap or so, or see what your all-time high speed is