New Civic Type R
07-28-2022, 03:48 AM
#61
That was his point. For some of us FWD is a no go off the rip, doesn’t matter what revoknuckle type magic they pull. It’s still being pulled around corners instead of pushed. And while it may be faster in the warm/dry around X circuit or whatever by .something or 2 seconds, whatever it is, inclement weather is a different story. I do find the “it’s faster around X” kind of funny because even us that do some trackdays or attack our mountain/canyon/rural twisty, none of us are racing for dollars. Lap times don’t mean really anything in reality. It’s just a metric that is a slice of a pie. The largest potion of that pie should be driver engagement for the type of driving you’re going to do with it. Are you a fair weather driver as it pertains to sporting purposes, or year round? The internet is a funny thing where you’ve got people who stat chase like they live right next to VIR, it’s always warm/dry year round and there is a river of whiskey or your favorite beer 5 minutes away. In reality it’s just got damn marketing.
I mean we got purists where if it’s a performance car, RWD is the only thing they’ll accept. AWD is “cheating” to them. I get that too. Fun driving to them is only ass hanging out oversteer. I get it because the last thing I’d want is a motorcycle with front and rear drive. On a bike it’s RWD only ICE only or I’m not interested. They can make whatever EV bike they want, not interested.
Or Honda “nerds” like “some” of the CTR buyers where it really doesn’t matter what it does, or what it don’t, it’s a Hype R. It’s a “JDM yo” status symbol for them. I’ve got a guy with one at my gym, with all the mods done to it that would drive Walt in Gran Torino, absolutely batshit. It’s riced out to the max. I talked to the owner. It’ll never see a track, or a corner that isn’t an underpass. Acceleration is stop light or highway pull, that’s it. Most buy them for image.
The good thing we got now is competition in this space, so we finally have some flavors instead of just 1-2 things. In the price space now we have the Twins, the Miata. Then you have the WRX, CTR, soon to be GRC, and the Golf R. IE shit that don’t cost 50, 60, 100k or more. It’s been a minute. 5-6 different manus offering performance something that is somewhat affordable comparatively. RWD, AWD, and FWD offerings. Coupes, vert (wish there was a choice of vert at this price area), sedan, and hatchbacks although there is only one remaining 3 door hatch on the market, the JCW. That’s a good thing as everyone has a somewhat affordable choice now. I think we can all agree on that. if 100% ICE 6MT is going away soon as all indicators say, at least at these price points, shit, finally we have some choices. Toyota didn’t make shit for over 20 years. Now they got 3 GR models. Honda hasn’t had an “all new” thing in the performance space since the S2000 which is why we are all here. VW has been consistent with their offering, same for Mazda. But the others haven’t even been around. Go up to 50k and now you add a 6th or 7th mfr with the Z, and then include the Supra. Golden days to me at the end. And I do think it’s the end over the next 5 years unless you enjoy dropping 100k on shit with a DCT.
I mean we got purists where if it’s a performance car, RWD is the only thing they’ll accept. AWD is “cheating” to them. I get that too. Fun driving to them is only ass hanging out oversteer. I get it because the last thing I’d want is a motorcycle with front and rear drive. On a bike it’s RWD only ICE only or I’m not interested. They can make whatever EV bike they want, not interested.
Or Honda “nerds” like “some” of the CTR buyers where it really doesn’t matter what it does, or what it don’t, it’s a Hype R. It’s a “JDM yo” status symbol for them. I’ve got a guy with one at my gym, with all the mods done to it that would drive Walt in Gran Torino, absolutely batshit. It’s riced out to the max. I talked to the owner. It’ll never see a track, or a corner that isn’t an underpass. Acceleration is stop light or highway pull, that’s it. Most buy them for image.
The good thing we got now is competition in this space, so we finally have some flavors instead of just 1-2 things. In the price space now we have the Twins, the Miata. Then you have the WRX, CTR, soon to be GRC, and the Golf R. IE shit that don’t cost 50, 60, 100k or more. It’s been a minute. 5-6 different manus offering performance something that is somewhat affordable comparatively. RWD, AWD, and FWD offerings. Coupes, vert (wish there was a choice of vert at this price area), sedan, and hatchbacks although there is only one remaining 3 door hatch on the market, the JCW. That’s a good thing as everyone has a somewhat affordable choice now. I think we can all agree on that. if 100% ICE 6MT is going away soon as all indicators say, at least at these price points, shit, finally we have some choices. Toyota didn’t make shit for over 20 years. Now they got 3 GR models. Honda hasn’t had an “all new” thing in the performance space since the S2000 which is why we are all here. VW has been consistent with their offering, same for Mazda. But the others haven’t even been around. Go up to 50k and now you add a 6th or 7th mfr with the Z, and then include the Supra. Golden days to me at the end. And I do think it’s the end over the next 5 years unless you enjoy dropping 100k on shit with a DCT.
07-28-2022, 05:43 AM
#62
I tracked a CTR a few months ago and while it was really fast, it was way too boring for me. This was the first time I have ever driven a FWD car in a performance setting and I have no desire to ever do it again.
The car is fabulous as a fun DD, but I would have no desire to drive it on track if I owned one.
The car is fabulous as a fun DD, but I would have no desire to drive it on track if I owned one.
07-28-2022, 06:49 AM
#63
Are we twins?
Been eyeballing the next car and this is the exact same list, which was amended by this new CTR, cause it actually looks good. Top of my list is the Supra manual, bottom GR86.
If you haven't realized we are in a very awesome time for cars that are performance and driver orientated -- consider the options you have for all under $70k:
Miata, Mustang, Camaro, Corvette, 400Z, Supra, CTR, GR86, Cayman, S4, RS3, Golf R, GTI, Veloster N, Stinger, WRX, Giulia, M3 (cheating here just a bit), Caddy V-sedans, C43.
Been eyeballing the next car and this is the exact same list, which was amended by this new CTR, cause it actually looks good. Top of my list is the Supra manual, bottom GR86.
If you haven't realized we are in a very awesome time for cars that are performance and driver orientated -- consider the options you have for all under $70k:
Miata, Mustang, Camaro, Corvette, 400Z, Supra, CTR, GR86, Cayman, S4, RS3, Golf R, GTI, Veloster N, Stinger, WRX, Giulia, M3 (cheating here just a bit), Caddy V-sedans, C43.
07-28-2022, 07:59 AM
#64
I had a Mazdaspeed 3 years ago that I used to track and autox during a time in my life where I was at a track or event more often than not. If you're serious about becoming a better driver and have little/no experience in racing FWD cars, they can teach you certain things that are harder to learn in a RWD and even AWD to a degree. I learned a lot about throttle control, understeer correction, trail braking, car setup and found ways to drive around an heavily understeer-prone car. Being quick in one type of vehicle is commendable...being able to adapt to any vehicle is impressive. While the FWD may have been slightly less fun (debatable), I wouldn't trade what I learned for any car or drivetrain.
Most people spending $40k+ on a Honda Civic are going to be weekend warriors or local autox at best....if they race their car at all which is fine.
Most people spending $40k+ on a Honda Civic are going to be weekend warriors or local autox at best....if they race their car at all which is fine.
07-28-2022, 08:54 AM
#65
For those interested in getting the CTR, if Honda is truly going to limit production, would you guys get a Civic Si or Integra (as-is, the Type S has not been announced) instead?
07-28-2022, 09:04 AM
#66
I had a Mazdaspeed 3 years ago that I used to track and autox during a time in my life where I was at a track or event more often than not. If you're serious about becoming a better driver and have little/no experience in racing FWD cars, they can teach you certain things that are harder to learn in a RWD and even AWD to a degree. I learned a lot about throttle control, understeer correction, trail braking, car setup and found ways to drive around an heavily understeer-prone car. Being quick in one type of vehicle is commendable...being able to adapt to any vehicle is impressive. While the FWD may have been slightly less fun (debatable), I wouldn't trade what I learned for any car or drivetrain.
Most people spending $40k+ on a Honda Civic are going to be weekend warriors or local autox at best....if they race their car at all which is fine.
Most people spending $40k+ on a Honda Civic are going to be weekend warriors or local autox at best....if they race their car at all which is fine.
I'd buy a lightly used GT350 with its track package. So much more car for the money than this CTR.
07-28-2022, 10:04 AM
#67
Tell me you don't know anything about performance driving, without telling you don't know anything about performance driving.
rob-2, you go first:
rob-2, you go first:
07-28-2022, 02:29 PM
#68
I had a Mazdaspeed 3 years ago that I used to track and autox during a time in my life where I was at a track or event more often than not. If you're serious about becoming a better driver and have little/no experience in racing FWD cars, they can teach you certain things that are harder to learn in a RWD and even AWD to a degree. I learned a lot about throttle control, understeer correction, trail braking, car setup and found ways to drive around an heavily understeer-prone car. Being quick in one type of vehicle is commendable...being able to adapt to any vehicle is impressive. While the FWD may have been slightly less fun (debatable), I wouldn't trade what I learned for any car or drivetrain.
Most people spending $40k+ on a Honda Civic are going to be weekend warriors or local autox at best....if they race their car at all which is fine.
Most people spending $40k+ on a Honda Civic are going to be weekend warriors or local autox at best....if they race their car at all which is fine.
And what you described is not racing dude. Racing means you got a contract, IE you driving for a living pays your mortgage, pays for the food on the table, etc. You’re hobbyists at best and even if there are “prizes” it’s akin to the stereotypical guy in the office who won the golf club tournament which just a tournament among golf club members. No pros entered the tournament, nobody from the PGA. Because a PGA is actually racing or competing and would wipe the floor with the lot of them. Track days and Auto X is not racing. It’s wannabe racing. That’s why it should be referred to as a track day or Auto X, not racing. There is semi pro stuff where obtain a racing license and race in a semi pro environment. That’s racing, but it should be called semi pro because honestly that’s what it is, novices, amateurs, not professionals. Professionals are contracted. Real races contain bleachers and fans. There is a podium celebration at the end. Practice sessions, qualifying, then the race itself.
Most people here, we’ve owned FWD LSD platforms and pushed them. RWD LSD platforms and pushed those. We aren’t Billy’s (sorry Billy, not you bro, you’re an actual pro) off the street jumping on the merry go round for the first time. I can emphatically tell you I have little to nothing to learn from a turbo charged FWD lsd platform on track or off it. Been there and done that, with a turbo FWD vehicle.
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rob-2 (07-29-2022)
07-29-2022, 04:01 AM
#69
One of my favorite cars, I've owned is probably a s2000. I do miss it at times and tried to get back into one recently and the prices are just too high. I currently own a Limited Edition Type R and it's a great all around car. If I had to pick a car just to drive on weekends, I'd pick s2000. But to have 1 car for everyday use, I have to say the Type R checks all the boxes. I still keep in touch with the guy I sold my last s2000. Maybe one day he'll sell it back to me. I plan on buying the new FL5 in the near future.
07-29-2022, 05:47 AM
#70
I dont debate ignorance but if you firmly believe your position good for you. If you're going to sit on the internet and tell me FWD learnings apply to RWD I know you have no idea what you're talking about. I'll even pick slightly different lines based on the drive train because of what it can and cannot do. Any time you want to jump on the track together you're welcome to join me. PM me directly.