My version of Lotus Elise vs FI-modded S2000
10-30-2012, 11:12 AM
#21
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Prior to this conversation, if you two met in person, you would probably get along. You both enjoy, and are very in tune with the same car. Got to love the Internet. Entertaining nonetheless.
10-30-2012, 01:02 PM
#22
10-30-2012, 10:59 PM
#24
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We get it, you love sucking on Phil @ BOE's teets and are brainwashed. Yes those kits are good but they are way more expensive. It takes a REV 400 to get to 310 whp and that is 8-10 grand so your extra 90 whp over a Katana/BWR kit will cost you anywhere from 4-6K more. Then it's debatable if your driveline will stay in one piece at those power levels (BOE reccomends upgrading) so you might as well tack on 3-5K more for a built transmission, clutch, backup motor. All said and done you're probably close to 12-15K for a reliable turnkey setup to get 310 whp which is now 3X4 times the cost of a reliable bolt in kit that makes 220 whp, not $1,000 bucks more. Doesn't seem like such a no brainer now especially when you don't even pony up the $500 more to buy proper tires.
As for the driveline, that’s not in question. Power for the money is.
Don’t pony up money for tires? I don’t need to toss a set of $1400 tires onto a car that only need the more affordable and just as effective street variant for less than half that. That’s like saying I should buy a dumptruck to take 2 bags of trash out. If I was able to track the car, or even push the car to the demand of a more aggressive tire, I would RUN a more aggressive tire.
Also the "tune" you get for with the BOE kit is a "canned" tune or base map as you call it that is uploaded with a flash tool since their tuner is in Germany. It's the same method as the canned Charlie X tune with BWR/VF/Katana kits. Unless the tuner adjusts your tune continuosly based on parameters specific to your car and conditions it's still a "base map" although the base map is VERY well refined and works in all sorts of climates on different cars.
In regards to the tires, if the factory thought the 2nd (or 3rd tier) S drives were sufficient they would have chosen it or something similar for an "OEM" Elise but they chose and developed the suspension for the AD07 which was the top tier street tire at the time as well as the A048 which was the R compound option. Obviously you know better than the engineers at Lotus or maybe you just call putting around on a farm road at 4/10ths "handling".
I simply posted here with my experiences between the two cars, and you feel the need to come and start this shit.
Please, just leave my thread and discontinue your opinion bashing. I am wrong to you, you are wrong to me, that’s what opinions are for.
10-31-2012, 05:14 AM
#25
I love how about a month ago I called a guy a douche for replying to a thread with a completely unrelated insult and I got moderated within hours.
Yet this shit ^^^ goes on for days with the personal attacks. Wow.
Yet this shit ^^^ goes on for days with the personal attacks. Wow.
10-31-2012, 05:51 AM
#26
We get it, you love sucking on Phil @ BOE's teets and are brainwashed. Yes those kits are good but they are way more expensive. It takes a REV 400 to get to 310 whp and that is 8-10 grand so your extra 90 whp over a Katana/BWR kit will cost you anywhere from 4-6K more. Then it's debatable if your driveline will stay in one piece at those power levels (BOE reccomends upgrading) so you might as well tack on 3-5K more for a built transmission, clutch, backup motor. All said and done you're probably close to 12-15K for a reliable turnkey setup to get 310 whp which is now 3X4 times the cost of a reliable bolt in kit that makes 220 whp, not $1,000 bucks more. Doesn't seem like such a no brainer now especially when you don't even pony up the $500 more to buy proper tires.
As for the driveline, that’s not in question. Power for the money is.
Don’t pony up money for tires? I don’t need to toss a set of $1400 tires onto a car that only need the more affordable and just as effective street variant for less than half that. That’s like saying I should buy a dumptruck to take 2 bags of trash out. If I was able to track the car, or even push the car to the demand of a more aggressive tire, I would RUN a more aggressive tire.
Also the "tune" you get for with the BOE kit is a "canned" tune or base map as you call it that is uploaded with a flash tool since their tuner is in Germany. It's the same method as the canned Charlie X tune with BWR/VF/Katana kits. Unless the tuner adjusts your tune continuosly based on parameters specific to your car and conditions it's still a "base map" although the base map is VERY well refined and works in all sorts of climates on different cars.
In regards to the tires, if the factory thought the 2nd (or 3rd tier) S drives were sufficient they would have chosen it or something similar for an "OEM" Elise but they chose and developed the suspension for the AD07 which was the top tier street tire at the time as well as the A048 which was the R compound option. Obviously you know better than the engineers at Lotus or maybe you just call putting around on a farm road at 4/10ths "handling".
I simply posted here with my experiences between the two cars, and you feel the need to come and start this shit.
Please, just leave my thread and discontinue your opinion bashing. I am wrong to you, you are wrong to me, that’s what opinions are for.
I can't even think of a set in stock sizes that cost $1400 bucks. There are better street tire options that don't even cost $700 bucks. You just must have missed them in your 4 years of researching the car. Hankook RS3's are $550 a set Dunlop Star Specs are $612 a set (even a set of Hoosiers isn't 1,400). Both those tires very closely resemble what came on the car originally. At least if you're going to drive slow and use crappy tires do some research and buy the correct sizes (175/55/16 and 225/45/17). I can't imagine how badly your car handles with your 175/45/16 and 215/40/17 setup and "grooved" shocks on springs not intended for that ride height.
I'm also not really sure why you put a silly front splitter on the car for extra "downforce" if you're not going to the track. Heck why even own a Lotus at all if you're just going to putt around town and not do any performance driving? You could pick up teenage boys and do your "street cruises" just as well in a slammed Scion TC with a park bench wing.
10-31-2012, 07:38 AM
#28
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My close friend has been dealing with BOE kits and its a joke. He has never made even close to the advertised power...I do believe now he has exceeded Phil's claims but that has come at the expense of a second engine, fully built head, pistons, rebuilt transmission, 3-4 trips from AZ to CA to Sector 111, and numerous dyno days.
Yea S drives are a joke...I wouldnt even put those on my S2000 to drive around town with...let alone an Elise. Why buy a car and then downgrade it? Silly.
People buy Elise's to either track...or to look cool in while sitting at traffic lights.
Anyway though, thanks for posting up a review/comparison of the two cars. Re affirmed everything I have ever thought of the two cars
Yea S drives are a joke...I wouldnt even put those on my S2000 to drive around town with...let alone an Elise. Why buy a car and then downgrade it? Silly.
People buy Elise's to either track...or to look cool in while sitting at traffic lights.
Anyway though, thanks for posting up a review/comparison of the two cars. Re affirmed everything I have ever thought of the two cars
10-31-2012, 02:54 PM
#29
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I love a good discussion with a little heated passion on the side. I actually learned from this discussion and most importantly helps me decides not to look for a Lotus Elise anymore.
