Most Significant Cars in American History
06-05-2011, 08:18 PM
#31
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Good effort, but the list is waaaay too heavily weighted to modern cars, IMHO. There's only 1 pre-war car on there, and only 4 cars on it are older than the 1950s! This list would be a good start for most significant American cars after 1970...
Also, the McLaren F1 was never officially imported to America. So it seems silly to include it on a list of significant American cars..
Andrew
Also, the McLaren F1 was never officially imported to America. So it seems silly to include it on a list of significant American cars..
Andrew
Ok, then what "classics" do YOU think should be on there?
06-05-2011, 08:20 PM
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Can't agree with the Genesis, Viper, 911, F1.
F1 - a great engineering exercise, but hasn't impacted anything. I've never even seen one on the road.
911 - if rear engined sportscars were so great, why it this the only one. The Miura would fit better as the first Supercar.
Viper - just a big giant engine attached to a sportscar chassis (but yes I want one). Maybe an Auburn or Packard or something in its place.
Genesis - really?
Even the Bug. I've never owned one, but it is a true oddball that probably only sold because it was cheap and simple. It is just a modern Model T.
What is needed is a station wagon and something like a 1976 Caddy Eldorado Convert.
F1 - a great engineering exercise, but hasn't impacted anything. I've never even seen one on the road.
911 - if rear engined sportscars were so great, why it this the only one. The Miura would fit better as the first Supercar.
Viper - just a big giant engine attached to a sportscar chassis (but yes I want one). Maybe an Auburn or Packard or something in its place.
Genesis - really?
Even the Bug. I've never owned one, but it is a true oddball that probably only sold because it was cheap and simple. It is just a modern Model T.
What is needed is a station wagon and something like a 1976 Caddy Eldorado Convert.
Yes, really the Genesis. It was not a typo by any means. What did the Caddy do?
06-05-2011, 08:27 PM
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A lot of people are getting a little emo about the Vette not being on there. Which is fine, just because a car is an icon doesn't mean it has done anything significant. I think it has gotten better over the years, especially with the release of the ZR-1 but it still has not done a whole lot in MY opinion. As for where I live. I grew up on a small farm in MN. Since then I have lived all over the USA, Korea for 2 years, Italy for 4 months, and Germany for 11 months so far.
While I lived in Korea I was able to tour the Genesis factory. Much like the S2000 and NSX the Genesis Coupe wasn't made for huge production numbers. It was made as a showcase car, to bring people to the dealerships. I forget the numbers but Hyundai had stats of before and after the Genesis Coupe was in the showroom, that car has done more for Hyundai than people realize. Hyundai is #5 in the world right now, I think the Genesis has a lot to do with that. That is why I think it is significant.
While I lived in Korea I was able to tour the Genesis factory. Much like the S2000 and NSX the Genesis Coupe wasn't made for huge production numbers. It was made as a showcase car, to bring people to the dealerships. I forget the numbers but Hyundai had stats of before and after the Genesis Coupe was in the showroom, that car has done more for Hyundai than people realize. Hyundai is #5 in the world right now, I think the Genesis has a lot to do with that. That is why I think it is significant.
06-05-2011, 09:50 PM
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I agree that an icon doesn't mean a car is significant. The F1 is a good example. That said, I think you may be discounting the Corvette a bit too much. I would say the Corvette has done about as much as the 911. The Corvette is perhaps the oldest car nameplate in production. I think since the end of the Buick Century perhaps only the Suburban has been around longer.
The Corvette, like the Genesis and S2000 has showcased what GM can do. It does have a number of firsts to it's name. It was the first car with forged alloy suspension arms (vs steal or cast iron). It was I think GM's first car with fuel injection and perhaps the first mass produced car with fuel injection. Though it had injection I think in the 1950s, like the turbo Corvair it wasn't a game changer. It was one of the earliest cars to have a modern IRS setup (multi-link vs swing axle). It of course has always been a styling icon. It had an alloy block motor when such things were very rare. It was the first car to pull 1G on a skid pad. It was the first car with full LCD instruments. It might have been the first car (at least the first sports car) with a HUD. It was the car that got GM to develop large scale hydroforming technologies and methods. Toyota now uses that technology to make pickup frame rails. It was the car for which GM developed the fiberglass springs (this technology is actually common in heavy trucks) It was the first sports car with the magnetic dampers now used by Ferrari, Audi and others. It is perhaps the best selling sports car of all time (depends on your definition of sports car). Perhaps most significant but least obvious is that the C5 was the car that helped GM relearn how to design cars. Reshaping a company is a VERY big deal.
The 911 also has a number of significant milestones like it was one of the cars that put turbo charging back on the map. It kept Porsche on the map and has been a backbone of the company for decades.
Given only fifteen spots I can see leaving the Corvette off the list but I can't see putting the Genesis on the list. Sure it's a halo car but so is the Corvette. It's just that the Corvette has held that spot for a long time. Also, it's not like the Genesis is the first "look what we can do" car. We have the LS400, several of the large Mercedes and Caddy models, the NSX etc.
Don't get me wrong, it's not an easy thing to draw up this list and I don't think you are going off half cocked but I don't agree with some of the members of the list.
The Corvette, like the Genesis and S2000 has showcased what GM can do. It does have a number of firsts to it's name. It was the first car with forged alloy suspension arms (vs steal or cast iron). It was I think GM's first car with fuel injection and perhaps the first mass produced car with fuel injection. Though it had injection I think in the 1950s, like the turbo Corvair it wasn't a game changer. It was one of the earliest cars to have a modern IRS setup (multi-link vs swing axle). It of course has always been a styling icon. It had an alloy block motor when such things were very rare. It was the first car to pull 1G on a skid pad. It was the first car with full LCD instruments. It might have been the first car (at least the first sports car) with a HUD. It was the car that got GM to develop large scale hydroforming technologies and methods. Toyota now uses that technology to make pickup frame rails. It was the car for which GM developed the fiberglass springs (this technology is actually common in heavy trucks) It was the first sports car with the magnetic dampers now used by Ferrari, Audi and others. It is perhaps the best selling sports car of all time (depends on your definition of sports car). Perhaps most significant but least obvious is that the C5 was the car that helped GM relearn how to design cars. Reshaping a company is a VERY big deal.
The 911 also has a number of significant milestones like it was one of the cars that put turbo charging back on the map. It kept Porsche on the map and has been a backbone of the company for decades.
Given only fifteen spots I can see leaving the Corvette off the list but I can't see putting the Genesis on the list. Sure it's a halo car but so is the Corvette. It's just that the Corvette has held that spot for a long time. Also, it's not like the Genesis is the first "look what we can do" car. We have the LS400, several of the large Mercedes and Caddy models, the NSX etc.
Don't get me wrong, it's not an easy thing to draw up this list and I don't think you are going off half cocked but I don't agree with some of the members of the list.
06-06-2011, 02:34 AM
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I agree that an icon doesn't mean a car is significant. The F1 is a good example. That said, I think you may be discounting the Corvette a bit too much. I would say the Corvette has done about as much as the 911. The Corvette is perhaps the oldest car nameplate in production. I think since the end of the Buick Century perhaps only the Suburban has been around longer.
The Corvette, like the Genesis and S2000 has showcased what GM can do. It does have a number of firsts to it's name. It was the first car with forged alloy suspension arms (vs steal or cast iron). It was I think GM's first car with fuel injection and perhaps the first mass produced car with fuel injection. Though it had injection I think in the 1950s, like the turbo Corvair it wasn't a game changer. It was one of the earliest cars to have a modern IRS setup (multi-link vs swing axle). It of course has always been a styling icon. It had an alloy
block motor when such things were very rare. It was the first car to pull 1G on a skid pad. It was the first car with full LCD instruments. It might have been the first car (at least the first sports car) with a HUD. It was the car that got GM to develop large scale hydroforming technologies and methods. Toyota now uses that technology to make pickup frame rails. It
was the car for which GM developed the fiberglass springs (this technology is actually common in heavy trucks) It was the first sports car with the magnetic dampers now used by Ferrari, Audi and others. It is perhaps the best selling sports car of all time (depends on your definition of sports car). Perhaps most significant but least obvious is that the C5 was the car that helped GM relearn how to design cars. Reshaping a company is a VERY big deal.
The 911 also has a number of significant milestones like it was one of the cars that put turbo charging back on the map. It kept Porsche on the map and has been a backbone of the company for decades.
Given only fifteen spots I can see leaving the Corvette off the list but I can't see putting the Genesis on the list. Sure it's a halo car but so is the Corvette. It's just that the Corvette
has held that spot for a long time. Also, it's not like the Genesis is the first "look what we can do" car. We have the LS400, several of the large Mercedes and Caddy models, the NSX etc.
Don't get me wrong, it's not an easy thing to draw up this list and I don't think you are going off half cocked but I don't agree with some of the members of the list.
The Corvette, like the Genesis and S2000 has showcased what GM can do. It does have a number of firsts to it's name. It was the first car with forged alloy suspension arms (vs steal or cast iron). It was I think GM's first car with fuel injection and perhaps the first mass produced car with fuel injection. Though it had injection I think in the 1950s, like the turbo Corvair it wasn't a game changer. It was one of the earliest cars to have a modern IRS setup (multi-link vs swing axle). It of course has always been a styling icon. It had an alloy
block motor when such things were very rare. It was the first car to pull 1G on a skid pad. It was the first car with full LCD instruments. It might have been the first car (at least the first sports car) with a HUD. It was the car that got GM to develop large scale hydroforming technologies and methods. Toyota now uses that technology to make pickup frame rails. It
was the car for which GM developed the fiberglass springs (this technology is actually common in heavy trucks) It was the first sports car with the magnetic dampers now used by Ferrari, Audi and others. It is perhaps the best selling sports car of all time (depends on your definition of sports car). Perhaps most significant but least obvious is that the C5 was the car that helped GM relearn how to design cars. Reshaping a company is a VERY big deal.
The 911 also has a number of significant milestones like it was one of the cars that put turbo charging back on the map. It kept Porsche on the map and has been a backbone of the company for decades.
Given only fifteen spots I can see leaving the Corvette off the list but I can't see putting the Genesis on the list. Sure it's a halo car but so is the Corvette. It's just that the Corvette
has held that spot for a long time. Also, it's not like the Genesis is the first "look what we can do" car. We have the LS400, several of the large Mercedes and Caddy models, the NSX etc.
Don't get me wrong, it's not an easy thing to draw up this list and I don't think you are going off half cocked but I don't agree with some of the members of the list.
06-06-2011, 04:29 AM
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Yes, really the Genesis. It was not a typo by any means. What did the Caddy do?
With all due respect, any Hyundai is a people mover, an ugly people mover for the masses. It is the same type of car that the model T was, the same as the Bug. My problem with including it in this list is that the slot for ugly people mover for the masses was done by Henry Ford 100 years ago. While 25 year olds may see a great car in the Genisis, someone a little older sees an asian econobox meant for their daughter to drive in high school, whether or not it sells a lot it hasn't done anything new except sold a bunch. It is the Chef-Boy-Ardee ravioli of cars, alot of people may buy them, but that does not make them anything special.
06-06-2011, 05:05 AM
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Originally Posted by aklucsarits' timestamp='1307307802' post='20651368
Good effort, but the list is waaaay too heavily weighted to modern cars, IMHO. There's only 1 pre-war car on there, and only 4 cars on it are older than the 1950s! This list would be a good start for most significant American cars after 1970...
Also, the McLaren F1 was never officially imported to America. So it seems silly to include it on a list of significant American cars..
Andrew
Also, the McLaren F1 was never officially imported to America. So it seems silly to include it on a list of significant American cars..
Andrew
Ok, then what "classics" do YOU think should be on there?
1903 Oldsmobile Runabout - The first car to be mass produced and built on an assembly line. (Ford later invented the conveyor-based assembly line)
1912 Cadillac Model 30 - The first car with a self starting engine
1912 National Speed - Essentially the 1st American sports car, it is the only stock car to ever win the Indy 500.
1932 Ford Model 18 - The first affordable V8-powered car for the masses. Prior to this, only incredibly expensive luxury cars had V8s.
1937 Cord - Groundbreaking automotive styling and technology. The first car with unibody construction. First front wheel drive car. First car with popup headlamps. It was one of the fastest production cars of its era and had stunningly futuristic styling.
etc.
Andrew
