Mazda ZoomZoom Live
09-30-2006, 06:25 PM
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Mazda ZoomZoom Live
Just got back from the Mazda ZoomZoom Live in Atlanta, and as usual, we had a great time. The "exercises" were a little different than last year, which I expected, but I didn't expect the cars to be so different. Last year both the RX8 and the (then) new MX5 made a very positive impression on me, but this year I came away with a totally different impression.
They used a Mazdaspeed 6 for the "Challenge" event (which is similar to an autocross) rather than the MX5, and while the handling of the AWD Mazdaspeed car impressed me, both the clutch and shifter were without a doubt the worst I've ever experienced in ANY car. I suspect the clutches had been eaten up by inept drivers thrashing the cars all day, but the shifters were simply HORRIBLE. They quite literally felt like a broom handle sticking in a bucket mud. The throw was WAY too long, and the feeling ...
... there WAS NO FEEL to the shifters, none at all.
Last year I was highly impressed by the RX8 (it's pretty darn nice for a four door four passenger vehicle) but this year the RX8 was just like the Mazdaspeed 6. The clutch action and feel and the shifter action and feel was totally unacceptable. Again, the clutches might have been on the way out due to extensive abuse all day long, but the shifter had zero feel, and a throw that was grossly excessive. I've driven trucks with shorter throw shifters.
For the last year I've been defending the RX8, but after my experience today I just can't do that anymore. The RX8 and Mazdaspeed 6 have the WORST shifters I've ever seen in anything making any pretense of being a "sporting" vehicle. There is no way I would want to own either of them and I can no longer recommend them to anyone else.
The other cars we drove were all automatics, and quite nice; All had excellent handling characteristics, but there is no way I'd buy a new Mazda with a stick shift. I'm still amazed at how badly the cars shifted. Our MY90 Miata has an infinitely better clutch and shifter, as do all the second gen Miata's in the CCR fleet.
I scored well enough to get a neat little MX5 model (with retractable soft top, removable boot, removable hard top, and display case), and we all had a heck of a good time, but this year I came away with a completely different impression of the Mazda lineup.
Have any of the rest of you been to any of the ZoomZoom events?
If so, what was your impression of the cars?
They used a Mazdaspeed 6 for the "Challenge" event (which is similar to an autocross) rather than the MX5, and while the handling of the AWD Mazdaspeed car impressed me, both the clutch and shifter were without a doubt the worst I've ever experienced in ANY car. I suspect the clutches had been eaten up by inept drivers thrashing the cars all day, but the shifters were simply HORRIBLE. They quite literally felt like a broom handle sticking in a bucket mud. The throw was WAY too long, and the feeling ...
... there WAS NO FEEL to the shifters, none at all.
Last year I was highly impressed by the RX8 (it's pretty darn nice for a four door four passenger vehicle) but this year the RX8 was just like the Mazdaspeed 6. The clutch action and feel and the shifter action and feel was totally unacceptable. Again, the clutches might have been on the way out due to extensive abuse all day long, but the shifter had zero feel, and a throw that was grossly excessive. I've driven trucks with shorter throw shifters.
For the last year I've been defending the RX8, but after my experience today I just can't do that anymore. The RX8 and Mazdaspeed 6 have the WORST shifters I've ever seen in anything making any pretense of being a "sporting" vehicle. There is no way I would want to own either of them and I can no longer recommend them to anyone else.
The other cars we drove were all automatics, and quite nice; All had excellent handling characteristics, but there is no way I'd buy a new Mazda with a stick shift. I'm still amazed at how badly the cars shifted. Our MY90 Miata has an infinitely better clutch and shifter, as do all the second gen Miata's in the CCR fleet.
I scored well enough to get a neat little MX5 model (with retractable soft top, removable boot, removable hard top, and display case), and we all had a heck of a good time, but this year I came away with a completely different impression of the Mazda lineup.
Have any of the rest of you been to any of the ZoomZoom events?
If so, what was your impression of the cars?
09-30-2006, 06:52 PM
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You must of driven a really beat up RX-8 because my friend has one with 30 000 miles and the shifter is excellent with very short throws. The clutch was also very light and easy to use.
Actually the RX-8 has one of the nicest shifter available, but that's just my opinion.
I think the RX-8 you drove was realllllllly beaten up because its shifter is usually what people praise!
Actually the RX-8 has one of the nicest shifter available, but that's just my opinion.
I think the RX-8 you drove was realllllllly beaten up because its shifter is usually what people praise!
09-30-2006, 07:27 PM
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ZoomZoom Live isn't coming here until next month. Looking forward to it.
But there was a Lexus test drive thing here today. I didn't have much time, so I only drove once. I threw the IS350 around super hard to test out the infamous hard to turn off stability control since you'll never be able to test that on a regular test drive. Dude came and yelled at me, asking me what I was doing.
But there was a Lexus test drive thing here today. I didn't have much time, so I only drove once. I threw the IS350 around super hard to test out the infamous hard to turn off stability control since you'll never be able to test that on a regular test drive. Dude came and yelled at me, asking me what I was doing.
09-30-2006, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Jacques79,Sep 30 2006, 09:52 PM
You must of driven a really beat up RX-8 because my friend has one with 30 000 miles and the shifter is excellent with very short throws. The clutch was also very light and easy to use.
Actually the RX-8 has one of the nicest shifter available, but that's just my opinion.
I think the RX-8 you drove was realllllllly beaten up because its shifter is usually what people praise!
Actually the RX-8 has one of the nicest shifter available, but that's just my opinion.
I think the RX-8 you drove was realllllllly beaten up because its shifter is usually what people praise!
The MY06 cars were great, but the MY07 cars sucked. Hard to say why, but if the cars were all torn up then Mazda shouldn't be using them to show what their cars are like. What they are showing people makes a very negative impression.
BTW, in spite of the clutches and shifters, the cars all handled wonderfully. The AWD Mazdaspeed 6 was particularly impressive, at least the equal of, if not superior to, the RX8's. I expect to see some impressive autocross results from the Mazdaspeed 6's.
09-30-2006, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by ItsBen,Sep 30 2006, 10:27 PM
ZoomZoom Live isn't coming here until next month. Looking forward to it.
But there was a Lexus test drive thing here today. I didn't have much time, so I only drove once. I threw the IS350 around super hard to test out the infamous hard to turn off stability control since you'll never be able to test that on a regular test drive. Dude came and yelled at me, asking me what I was doing.
But there was a Lexus test drive thing here today. I didn't have much time, so I only drove once. I threw the IS350 around super hard to test out the infamous hard to turn off stability control since you'll never be able to test that on a regular test drive. Dude came and yelled at me, asking me what I was doing.
I'd really like to know if we just had a field full of torn up Mazda's or if what we saw represents what we can expect from Mazda now.
Anybody else been to a ZoomZoom this year?
09-30-2006, 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by ItsBen,Sep 30 2006, 10:27 PM
I threw the IS350 around super hard to test out the infamous hard to turn off stability control since you'll never be able to test that on a regular test drive. Dude came and yelled at me, asking me what I was doing.
Jamey, one of the CCR drifters, took one of the MX-5's out on the course and used clutch kicks to drift it all the way around the course. They cut one corner off his "ticket." If you get two corners cut off they won't let you drive their cars anymore. Ryan, our chief mechanic, managed to get both corners of his ticket clipped. For whatever reason I was really on my game today, and every run I made surprised me. If I could do what I did today with any consistency I'd be planning a trip to the SOLO Nationals. I beat the target time on the "Challenge" by over two seconds (not too shabby for a 58 year old-man), and when I got out of the car after the run the people waiting in line all applauded.
The ZoomZoom events are the biggest motorsports bang for the buck, because they're great events, and they're free.
09-30-2006, 08:12 PM
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We have a a huge former Naval base in my town so we get all the events here. Out of the car events, the GM ones are the best just because of the grandness of their courses. So many cars, smaller lines, and more unique courses. Mazda's follow behind it because of its timed challenges, but the lines are too long! Lexus is just plain dull, but they serve decent food.
I'll report back here next month. But I agree with Jacques, its likely that people just killed the clutch. Last year in both the Mazda and GM events, it reeked of burned clutch. Lots of people who don't know how to drive manual use these events to learn, like my friend. Haha.
I'll report back here next month. But I agree with Jacques, its likely that people just killed the clutch. Last year in both the Mazda and GM events, it reeked of burned clutch. Lots of people who don't know how to drive manual use these events to learn, like my friend. Haha.
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10-01-2006, 07:08 AM
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i went this year and last. the miata is spectacular. the only thing i really don't like about it is the high sill it has now. it doesn't feel like an old european roadster any more as you really feel like you're sitting IN the car. besides that the car handles great and has a really nice interior. so nothing changed from last year to this year with the miata.
the rx-8 last year - i was really impressed with it. this year i was not. i don't know why that is. it may have been that i just got out of the miata and was diasppointed that it just didn't handle as well as the miata...maybe handle isn't the right word but the miata is just so tossable because of its size it makes it a blast to drive. the rx8 while fun just didn't put a big smile on my face.
the mazdaspeed 6 was ok...it had a lot of torque which was nice for a change but felt like a very heavy car.
the cx7 was pretty sweet...i was really impressed with its handling and interior as well.
the rx-8 last year - i was really impressed with it. this year i was not. i don't know why that is. it may have been that i just got out of the miata and was diasppointed that it just didn't handle as well as the miata...maybe handle isn't the right word but the miata is just so tossable because of its size it makes it a blast to drive. the rx8 while fun just didn't put a big smile on my face.
the mazdaspeed 6 was ok...it had a lot of torque which was nice for a change but felt like a very heavy car.
the cx7 was pretty sweet...i was really impressed with its handling and interior as well.
10-01-2006, 07:27 AM
#10
Originally Posted by RED MX5,Sep 30 2006, 10:36 PM
Yea, the RX8's I drove last year had light clutches with a smooth engagement, and shifters that left nothing to complain about. This year the clutches held well, but engaged too early and too quickly, and the shifters were just HORRIBLE. The cars are a MY newer, and I'm wondering if it is more likely that the cars have changed or more likely that ALL the cars at ZoomZoom had the same problem with their shifters. If they were better at the start of the day then they sure went south quickly. I can see that with the clutches (one fool can distroy a clutch in a matter of seconds) but I can't think of anything that would make shifters in several different cars have the same stick in the mud feel.
The MY06 cars were great, but the MY07 cars sucked. Hard to say why, but if the cars were all torn up then Mazda shouldn't be using them to show what their cars are like. What they are showing people makes a very negative impression.
BTW, in spite of the clutches and shifters, the cars all handled wonderfully. The AWD Mazdaspeed 6 was particularly impressive, at least the equal of, if not superior to, the RX8's. I expect to see some impressive autocross results from the Mazdaspeed 6's.
The MY06 cars were great, but the MY07 cars sucked. Hard to say why, but if the cars were all torn up then Mazda shouldn't be using them to show what their cars are like. What they are showing people makes a very negative impression.
BTW, in spite of the clutches and shifters, the cars all handled wonderfully. The AWD Mazdaspeed 6 was particularly impressive, at least the equal of, if not superior to, the RX8's. I expect to see some impressive autocross results from the Mazdaspeed 6's.
Bottom line - my experience completely contradicted yours.
We had two MS6's taken out of the lineup for ruined clutches, so they were definitely getting ragged on. I was told by one of the organizers that they're usually replacing clutches after EVERY event! AWD, less-than-stellar drivers, and general racing abuse take their toll on the cars.... The "pro" driver said that he's driven MS6's off the showroom floor and they tended to drive quite a bit better - the clutches were easier to modulate and the shifters were more precise. I can believe it, after hearing all the gear grinds and seeing cars stall out the three hours I was there.
Just FYI, I attended the event in Dallas, not Atlanta.