koala

If this truck sells more than 30k units in its first year of production, will you try to start accepting vehicles for what they are, and not what you think they should be?

mikegarrison

The "tail wagging the dog" think you talk about is due primarily to the geometry of the tow system, not the mass of the vehicles involved. Only after the tailwagging has started does the mass come into play. Fifth-wheels tow nice and stable even when the trailer weighs far more than the tractor.

Basically, if you are relying on the weight of the tractor to be more than the weight of the trailer then you are treating the symptom rather than the cause.

steve c

I take it that you are interpreting tail wagging as the trailer moving around, my insinuation was that the trailer begins to tell the tow vehicle what is what.

Mass out back, regardless of axles and brakes has a large impact on the vehicle towing. When the weight out back is nearing the weight towing that situation becomes more pronounced.

To your point, I was once party to a coachmen towing a jeep towing a trailer with motorcycles (3 feet under the legal limit). That thing snaked down the highway, it was quite amusing to watch drivers line up to make runs at the rig in an attempt to get by without being hit.

Purple_sky

I will take a wager with you on that. How about it?

steve c

I will give my first born.

Stipulations of the bet are this:

Honda must sell 30,000 + in the first year

Loser must put statement to be determined by the winner (and approved by the moderators) in their signature for a period of one month.

mikegarrison

Well you can't ignore that you now have a total mass of 2.5x what you had before, sure. But it is extremely common for tow rigs to be towing quite a bit more than their own mass. You just have to know how to do it, that's all. It's like any other driving experience -- it is a learned skill.

Frankly, if you insist on always having a tow rig that weighs more than your towed load, you are doing things very inefficiently.

If the truck is properly sized to deal with the load (large enough radiator capacity, good enough brakes, drive train sized for the load, dampers and springs sized for the load, proper tires, etc.) then there is no reason to insist on a massive truck to pull a 5000 load.

Purple_sky

I don't want your first born! Given the way you talk to people on here, I'm afraid I won't be able to tolerate/handle your first born or "any born". No offense! Knocking on cars is fine, cuz this is a car forum anyhow, but telling people to stfu and other offensive names is not the same. Sure, I sometimes call some people morons and idiots, but it's still very minor.

Anyhoo, yes, I will take that wager. In exactly one year from its official debut, Honda must sell over 30K units or I will lose. What we wager is up to you because I don't much care, for I won't lose anyway.

koala

Are we counting canadian sales? because I'm probably buying one

steve c

Outside of a single post in street encounters this month, I can't think of any time I have called others names or asked them to STFU.

No doubt, but we are back to the earlier point that the ability to tow 5,000 pounds ... and the ability to really tow 5,000 pounds, i.e. in comfort are very different things.

koala

I have to give steve credit there, he doesn't go around name calling.

But steve, you have to admit you come across as a pretty harsh critic of anything that doesn't suit you.