Get a grip Karl I am clearly on the college level with the smilies!

Have a blessed day!

 

While I'm glad that the U.S. and other countries are making an effort to have a cleaner running, more efficient vehicle that doesn't pollute, I think we should step back and think about "middle east" statements.

I know you were on the gentle side of comments, but I have heard much harsher.

Think about this. The Saudis and other Arab familes that are doin BUSINESS with us have been doing BUSINESS with us in a very good fashion for a long time. Even with the slash and burn tactics that the U.S uses in the middle east, the oil business keeps flowing.

Besides countries that actually produce the stuff to sell it on a large scale (opec), we're getting oil at the CHEAPEST prices in the world. Europe's gas has been in the $4-5 range for a while. It's expensive in Asia as well.

 

[QUOTE=B serious,May 2 2008, 12:50 PM] While I'm glad that the U.S. and other countries are making an effort to have a cleaner running, more efficient vehicle that doesn't pollute, I think we should step back and think about "middle east" statements.

I know you were on the gentle side of comments, but I have heard much harsher.

Think about this.

 

Then why is it that whenever I see on the evening news that price for a barrel of oil hit a new record, the next day all the prices at the pump jumped $.20?? You guys can tell me all day long how they are two different things, but somebody should go tell the guys at the gas station.

 

Well the way I look at it. The whole price of oil boils down to #1 the war and #2 greed.
Its not supply and demand, the weak dollar, the price to refine it or anything. I feel (and I have no concrete evidence of this) that mid-east powers that be are raising the cost of oil per barrel to finance the war against us. We (the US oil companies) allow this only because the bottom line fattens their pockets. There are some very good points being made here but the profit the American companies make is history making and mind blowing yet the process to drill, refine and transport the oil hasn't changed at all nor has it gotten anymore costly. The greed of these companies is slowly killing our country and sending it into a recession. A recession they financially will never have to suffer from due to the fact that that are financially secure from being the cause of it in the first place.

 

Reasonable question. It's based off futures contracts which are what they sound like. You are missing another relatively basic factor-variable costs. Taxes are more or less constant, refining costs more or less constant-the variable factors are crude prices which also translate in to higher transportation costs.

So if taxes were raised/lowered every week, gas prices would move accordingly.

However, gas prices are actually still a somewhat lagging indicator. For instance, if crude stays roughly where it's at and all things are held equal, we will be well over 4 dollars per gallon average over the summer.

 

No offense pal, but you [among others, you aren't alone by any stretch, in fact you are probably sadly in the majority] have no idea what you are talking about. I mean literally, you don't understand any underlying factors of any of the matters at hand. That's also why [not coincidently] you have zero evidence to back your idea up, I'd call it a theory with quotation marks but usually theories at least have some defensible reasoning to back them.

Here's something you should consider (estimated b/c sources)-

Firm Profit Revenue Profit Margin
General Electric(06)- 20bn 160bn 13.7%
Citibank(06)- 20bn 80bn 20%
Wal-mart(06)- 18bn 320bn 6%
Exxon Mobile(06)- 36bn 360bn 10%

Looks to me like the banking industry is making the easy money. WMT make just as much money gross as exxon mobile, I guess we should all burn down WMT's too. Wait, there are people that hate that firm too. Wonder why? They are looking for excuses for only God knows what.

Petro China (PTR) is just as big as Exxon is, I guess it's all a conspiracy. Here is a good excerpt from Wiki-invest:

"ExxonMobil (NYSE: XOM), an energy company with a product portfolio ranging from crude oil to industrial lubricants, is the second largest company in the world by market capitalization, having recently been passed by PetroChina Company (PTR). The company has been valued at over $500 billion at its peak, and had 2007 net income of $40.6 billion, the highest in U.S. corporate history. Exxon's successes stem from a steady rise in oil prices due to increasing energy consumption worldwide, a decreased oil supply because of heated geopolitical conflict in oil-rich regions, and a persistent lack of widely adopted mass-market alternatives to petroleum energy.
Exxon generated the majority of its earnings from upstream exploration and production (E&P) activities, producing 4.18 million barrels of oil equivalent (MMBOE) every day in 2007. Its 2006 output amounted to 3% of the world's oil and 2% of global energy production. The geographical diversity of Exxon's E&P activities makes it less vulnerable to the regional production uncertainties that plague the industry. The company is also an international leader in the downstream refining industry, with 35,000 retail stations and over 5.7 million barrels per day of refining capacity.

ExxonMobil leads a pack of six global "supermajor" petroleum companies which explore for, produce, refine, and market oil and gas. Of these six (including BP (BP), ChevronTexaco (CVX), Total (TOT), ConocoPhillips (COP), and Royal Dutch Shell), ExxonMobil has consistently produced the highest revenue, income, and returns on capital employed (31.8%). Exxon also excels in technological advances, and its safety record led the industry in 2006.

Despite these strengths, Exxon remains largely at the mercy of market maker OPEC, an organization of petroleum-producing nations that controls global oil prices by holding about 40% of the world's crude oil supply. And while rising oil prices may be a boon to Exxon and other supermajors, increasing petroleum costs encourage the development of alternative energies such as biofuels, posing a longer-term threat to the oil industry."

 

I would say I stand corrected but in this case I think you further proved my point "an organization of petroleum-producing nations that controls global oil prices by holding about 40% of the world's crude oil supply". These companies that control the supply further control the financial stability of other economies and they know this. Believe me the development of biofuels, fuel cells, hydrogen power may eventually even put these companies out of business or at least under control but the powers that be have made more than enough money to really be significantly affected by it IMO. If you can without a doubt say that absolutely positively NONE of this money is going to help finance the war against the US and other countries or terrorism I'd have to say prove it and if you could I would then and only then say I would stand corrected. Other than that it all just facts n figures that are fed to us buy those are getting away with the gouging to make it all seem legit and necessary. Im just not buying it. Just my .02

 

Interesting to see this thread evolve...

Sidetrack... What about offering some sort of insurance incentive for people insuring multiple vehicles with annual low mileage? So you could have capacity and efficiency, when needed.

I still stand by my post 5 pages ago, but if we could offer incentive maybe thats a step in the right direction, or at least soften the blow, without totally ruining sally/sam house-wife/ husband who drives the kids to and from school and practice.

I agree with the >20 MPG can be considered as a more severe form of waste, and as a mild utilitarian, I say the government should have to/ want to apply a certain restriction or tax for those that operate vehicles of that magnitude without utilizing their full potential.

I see the other side where super/sports cars come in, but those are such heavily taxed items, whose market share is so small, I dont think it matters.

I see a lot of waste in socal, and the buzz of gas and home prices is on everyones minds. I just don't see the point. If you need an 8-10mpg SUV you shouldn't be concerned because you NEED its capacities, If you need a 1-2 million dollar home in the foothills or beach side, than you shouldn't be complaining about the housing market, because your NEEDS are being met.

Now, offering incentives or deals to people foreclosing on their 1-2 million dollar homes... i mean common... thats like offering a safety mat for people playing the stock markets. You win some you loose some. Buying a home as an investment is a gamble, when did it become a concrete form of income?

 

CRAZY THREAD!

My 2 cents: Remember crude oil is a international commodity. The $ has lost ~30% of its value in the last 2 years. Therefore even if a barrel of crude oil costs the same in Europe it would be up 30% here.

Either way you look at it - WE ARE SCREWED!! Our whole country/culture is built on endless consumption of energy. In the past It was USA and Europe that consumed the most. However, Europe has always been very frugal on their use/abuse of energy. They own small cars, small houses, use mass transit. The USA on the other hand is the complete opposite. Heck - Houston's idea of mass transit is buses. Now in the last 20 years - Asia is booming and the energy demands have gone up. South America is coming along and so is the middle east. So either we drill for more oil and run out faster or we figure out new alternatives or we start building Nucular(as G.W. would put it) plants for all the basic energy needs(home).

None of these are happening any time soon. So bend over baby and pay up!

Btw, I went to a DE last wknd - total gas cost - $325 for tow vehicle, track car, and wife dropping by. OUCH!