s.hasan546

i don't know where you get $20k from... You can find BRAND NEW boxster s from dealers between 6-10% off. Just passed on one for $65k OTD + taxes. C7s with z51 + options are running between 60-$67k depending on options and dealer markups.

JonBoy

You can get a Z51 with MRC, 7MT and 1LZ (base trim) for mid-$50K OTD. A few dealers (Kerbeck, specifically) are discounting $2500 off MSRP already, which would mean about $55K + taxes, give or take.

The Cayman S I optioned out to the way I'd like it (with not a lot of options, really - bigger wheels, a few sport options) was about $73K before taxes. That's close to a $20K difference when optioned somewhat similarly to the same type of Vette. Some standard features on the Vette are typically optional on Porsches.

Anrosphynx

i don't know where you get $20k from... You can find BRAND NEW boxster s from dealers between 6-10% off. Just passed on one for $65k OTD + taxes. C7s with z51 + options are running between 60-$67k depending on options and dealer markups.
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I just priced out a Vette with performance exhaust, navigation, ect and it was 59.
I just priced out a Boxster with similar stats and it was 71.

QUIKAG

I'm going to completely disagree with you. You're working class wealthy. You have earned your own money (I assume your construction gig is a job you got through your own credentials and not because your daddy works for Trammel Crow or whoever) but you are also still relatively young and have real life concerns that make value a significant factor. You're climbing the ladder and doing well, but that's not even remotely comparable to most wealthy people in our neck of the woods who don't know of a world outside of Highland Park and who live off of trust funds. For those actual wealthy people, value means jack shit. They want the fanciest brands so that all of their friends who obsess over the fanciest brands will take notice. They're brand whores, plain and simple.

Now, even wealthy people of that variety are probably generally smart with their money... That is to say, with the majority of their money. The funds they use to maintain their wealth are probably well managed and few major risks are taken. They don't fall into the trappings of many poor people who just don't know any better. But they also have discretionary income, and I assure you that there is nothing closely resembling a value analysis that factors into their decision to spend said discretionary income.

Now, for the record, I'm not insulting you at all, nor am I not paying proper respects to your accomplishments. On the contrary, I too am a self-made man and I too am climbing the ladder. For people who come from normal, or in my case, very modest means, AND for people who place value on speed above brand prestige, sure, the Vette makes perfect sense and the 911 seems overpriced. But for people who have more discretionary income than they know what to do with, why would they sully their good names by driving a Chevrolet?

There are no shortage of millionaires and even just top 5% wage earners who think like you, but don't go thinking that that's how most people with money to burn think.
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I don't know where to start. You are talking about the upper fraction of the upper 1% where value means nothing and they only care about brand prestige and care nothing about price. Yes, they are out there and there are quite a few of them. These people help keep Porsche in business.

For the rest of the 99.8% of the people, value is an issue. Now, some people put value onto the backburner because they want the perception of true wealth and are willing to spend themselves into massive debt to put up that illusion. That's probably 25% or so of the Porsche buyers. The middle 50% are well-to-do professionals that like Porsche, like the brand, like the prestige factor, have the money, and want a Porsche. Absolutely nothing wrong with that. A Porsche is a very well made and very nice car.

The top 10% of Porsche buyers are the people that have a ton of money and fit your profile. They are pretty rare on a % basis.

There are so many different people out there with different income/expense/wealth profiles, we could talk about this for days. I wasn't putting my self into the category of "most wealth people are wealthy because they don't piss....", it was an overarching statement that is definitely more applicable to the VAST majority of your people than your statement about the Highland Park/trust fund babies, etc. of the world. Again, they are out there, but it's a very small % of the general population, very small. You may live in a bubble where you are exposed to them more often than others, but it doesn't change the facts.

I only took umbrage to the comment about people who buy Vettes can't afford Porsche. It's a stupid/asisine statement period...

Chris Stack

I built a C7 on the site the other day; basically every option but appearance packs (no stripes, carbon fiber, etc). Think it was Z51 + 3LT + performance exhaust + Magnetic ride control, and red brake calipers. Was like $67k. And that's basically everything.

QUIKAG

Read my post more carefully. I'm talking about "performance" value, not overall value. Overall value is more predicated on the factors that each individual person determines. Clearly, MANY people like the values demonstrated by the Porsche and buy accordingly. No problem with that at all. Again, it's an awesome car.

But, from a pure performance value perspective, Porsche is losing big time lately. It can't keep up, so Porsche is catering to other qualities that differentiate it from the more plebian Corvette. It's smart and many luxury brands do that. Again, nothing wrong with that. But, for us cheap bastards of the world that value performance, durability, track warranty coverage, and overall bang for the buck, the Vette is a compelling combination, even moreso with the C7. Porsche used to be as fast or faster than comparable Corvettes and they were MUCH better in build quality, materials, etc. That gap has disappeared on the performance front and quality is WAY closer now.


This is all going to be subjective and based on your personal experiences. I know many truly wealthy people that don't give a crap about cars at all. They'd rather put six figures on a few hours of blackjack in Vegas than buy a fancy car. There are very flashy truly wealthy people, but I think there are more truly wealthy people that aren't that flashy. They may have a nice house, a ranch, a vacation home or two, but you really won't know about it based on what they drive.

Again, if you prefer a Boxster or Cayman over a C7, that is certainly your choice and it's not a bad one. I like driving fast on the track for weekend fun, so I've bought one of the fastest cars any manufacturer makes for that. It's my thing. For other people, it'll be cruising down the road of a fancy part of town in their 911 and they don't care if it has 200hp or 600hp, as long as it's a Porsche 911. Again, their choice.

It's just getting harder when you have a 911 that has more in option cost than a base C7 Vette which is now a very good car all around. Is the C7 perfect? No. Is it flawless? No. Could overall quality be better? Sure, but probably not for the $$. It's just becoming a harder money value proposition when the Vette is as good or better in a lot of areas and the P-car is better in less areas. Factor in the huge price differential and it's just getting harder for people to justify a P-car unless they just gotta have the P-car for whatever reason. That's my main point.

mosesbotbol

They sure seem to sell enough of them.

Porsche is more investment worthy. Their designs don't grow old like Corvette. 20 year old 911 still looks & drives pretty cool; how about that 20 year old Vette?

s.hasan546

no dealers are discounting off msrp with the z51 package from what I've seen. On verts & non-z51 yes they are.

s.hasan546

Depends all on how you price it out. A z51 Corvette fully optioned can run up to $67k. A nicely optioned one is around $63-$65k. Plus your are getting $0 off. On the Boxster you can get $4-5k off. So, for me IMO, Id rather buy a boxster S with a $71k msrp for $66k, than a c7 MSRP 64k for $64k.

Meanwhile in 2 years the c7 stingray will become common, be overshadowed by the z06, & will be worth much less than the boxster s.

Slithr

How about that 50 year old Vette?