LSs1Power

I have always liked the BMW over the MB until BMW came with the new ugly styling(7 series now and 5, 3 series to come with the same styling). I drove all kind of MB's and BMW's the old and the new. I still dont like the styling of the new 7 series, but i have to say that the 7 series is better than the S class in the driving pleasure segment, but until BMW fixes their looks and lack of power i have to switch to MB cars and willing to sacrafice driving pleasure for power and looks. For me E55 all the way, 12.8-13.0 at 112-114 in the 1/4mile and still rides, looks nice and aggressive, what more do u want. I just wish MB can make Manuals for their AMG cars at least.

JonBoy

I would still question the use of 469hp on the street. You're talking seriously extra-legal speeds to really use it that often, since once you're out of second gear, you're over the speed limit of almost anywhere in North America I know.

I can see a person punching it when accelerating out of a corner, etc, etc, but that's just toying with the power - chances are you don't even hit the power peak and it's certainly not a sustained use of the power. You're better off with less power and tighter gearing if you really want to use your car's power more often each day.

I think UL had it about right - the best sports cars for driving on the street are those in which you can use ALL of the power a LOT of the time without putting your life, car, or license in too much danger. As he said, the Miata is fully capable of this, as is the Toyota MR2, and the rest of the smaller sports coupes (Civic Si, SVT Focus, Elise, even S2000)...etc, etc. They say (and I don't know this from experience) that even the Focus ZX2 is great fun to drive because you can take it to its limits quite easily and controllably on the street. I shudder to think of owning a Focus, but that's what has been said...

My other $0.02.

alexf20c

Yeah, but it's still nice to know it's there.

But sometimes it's necessary: When that Z06 is all over your rear bumper on the freeway on-ramp, 469hp would be nice to shake him off.

JonBoy

LOL. Too true, but as I said, that means getting into extra-legal speeds. Not that we don't speed, only that one would rarely use that kind of power fully.

Still, as you say, nice to know it's there. If nothing else, you know what the car could do if you had a diaper on....

Fanman

By your thinking than the S2000 has more than enough power, yet we see many of the people installing SC's & turbos. I think the acceleration aspect, and the time to speed, ohhh a moderate 100 mph will suffice. True that you will probably be using the power very little time on an average commute, but it is nice to know it is there. Too much, is just right. I have to disagree with the person that said that MBZ needs to do it NA, vs. SC or turbos (600 series). The difference now is so great that it justifies the SC. The M5 has 400 hp, the new E55 has 469, and the new SL55 has 493hp. With a few pieces you are looking at an easy 550hp. The M engines because they are NA are a bit more difficult to fix up and add 60-70 hp (I know Hamann did it but at about $18K). With $5K they are adding 60hp & 70 lb.-ft of torque (550hp & 660 lb. ft. for the new SL 600 !!!) Totally overkill, but if I ever hit the lottery I'm heading to the MBZ dealership for my "cruise car." with 500+ hp.

JonBoy

Yeah, I think the S2000 does have more than enough power. For those installing SCs or turbos, well, to each their own. I'm not saying it's wrong to have all that power, only that there is a place beyond which the power is all but unusable on the street legally (or even close to legally - ie, under 90mph or so). The S2000 actually a bad example for adding more power through forced induction since the power gains aren't THAT noticeable (from what I'm told and what I've read, mind you) in the normal, day-to-day rev range of most people.

That said, I think about 300 or 400 hp is about as high as you could go and keep the power usable. The NSX (290hp, more like 315 or so), Vette (350hp), and normally aspirated 911 Porsches (320hp...I think - they just got a bump and I'm not sure of the new number) all offer relatively useful power. The Ferraris, top end Porsches, and Lambos are just a little over the top for usable power.

Still, offer me any of these cars and I'll gladly put up with "more power than I can use". Perhaps, in the end, that's the bottom line for most of us.

alexf20c

Well, this reminds me of a 550 Maranello we test drove awhile ago. The damn thing could pull cleanly from 30mph to 120mph in 6th gear! Let's see an S2000 do that!

As UL pointed out, a Miata's available power is almost 100% usable 100% of the time, albeit you have to wring it out. With a 469bhp E55 (or any insanely over-powered car), you don't need to press as hard to achieve decent performance. True, it's nice to take a car to its limit and back, to drive it ten-tenths, but seriously, that gets tiring after awhile.

Cruising on the freeway at 65mph in 6th gear, you want to squeeze into a spot in the adjacent lane to make your exit. In our S2000 you need to drop two gears, whereas the E55 requires nothing more than a twitch of the right foot. Granted, the E55's full 469bhp can get a bit hairy under WOT, but the fact that you only need 50% power is a welcome convenience.

And though the full 469hp in the E55 (or any high-powered car's full-throttle power) is only needed when showing off, racing, or acting stupid, yet it allows the car to be driven rather sedately (in relative terms) while still being enjoyable. 50% throttle in an E55 (or Z06, Turbo, Modena, etc.) is a bit different from 50% throttle in a Civic, Elantra, or even an S2000 and Miata.

It's more of a creature comfort, per se.

GNALUZU

What I meant by my original statement is that I do not really consider MBZ to be a builder of a high performance engine. I agree that it is very difficult, and expensive, to get any more power out of the M5. But in some sense, to compare the M5 to the new E55 is like comparing apples to oranges. The current M5 has been out for a few years now and it is still on top of the pack. Yes, the new E55 will have more power, but in my mind, I still can't get over the fact that MBZ had to use a SC to get the power out of the engine.

It is just two different types of thinking I guess. I have nothing against MBZ. I actually went and test drove the C32 before I put the order in for my M3. I just didn't care for it as much, but that is when it comes down to the little things. For me, it is important for the car to have a manual transmission.

Of course, when the E60 M5 comes out it will be back on top again. Speculated to have a V-10 with 500-550 bhp. Now that will be impressive. Of course, pretty soon it won't matter how much power you have, because it will be so difficult to get it onto the pavement without melting your tires.

JT-KGY

Not sure if thats enough to shake off a Z06.....

alexf20c

The E55 hits 150mph in 21.8sec.