hyperpm

MS3 Laguna Seca

Edmunds got these times though:

2009: 1:51.33
2010: 1:49.99

Sr2oD3

the car holds very impressive numbers. having said that, I think it's ugly as hell.

MrClean

That's a notable difference, especially since the new car is heavier with the same motor.

I seem to remember reading the new MS3 has new, wider rubber underneath. I wonder how the lap times would be with the same wheel-tire combos on each car.

In any case, I still can't get past the oddly styled front and rear ends of the new one.

ABCVTEC

Wow it's as good looking as the new STIs.

Which look awful.

BPUKiller

Mazda=Honda, great cars ruined by ugly mugs.

Jakup

They actually look better in person. Nevertheless, I say the GTI does everything equal (utility, reliability) or better (looks, feel, refinement) for the same price while only sacrificing a little at the track. Keep in mind the MS3 is listed as 63+ hp over the GTI but (the last gens, anyway) seemed to only dyno ~35hp more from the several I saw.

L1ttle Wing

And unlike the MS3, the GTI motors will take significant mods without popping like zits on a high schooler. My best friend's modded GTI used to destroy my lightly modded AP2, and he is going on 60,000 miles with no major issues.

PedalFaster

That's odd -- in their Lightning Lap series, Car and Driver went faster in the 2007 (3:16.0) than they did in the 2010 (3:16.2).

budgy

the MS3 motor is pretty strong, but I will admit once you get over 300WHP its a ticking time bomb.

in terms of overall what is the better car/value I would say GTI > MS3.

In terms of what is the better performer MS3 > GTI by a significant margin. My bro has a new MKVI GTI and I have a 1rst Gen MS3, they drive totally different, but at the end of the day even though the chassis are both solid on each car the LSD and the extra torque on the MS3 make it a much more competent car for track use. The GTI is just so much more refined, especially with the DSG gearbox, his car feels like a luxury cruiser compared to my MS3 and makes me feel like my car is made of tin and it just rattles over every bump in the road.

The new MS3 not only has wider tires it has wider wheels, and much better dampening in the suspension, the previous gen MS3 was notoriously underdamped from the factory. Realistically once you go aftermarket suspension and wheels the first Gen is the better performer due to having less weight.