Luckyaze

When you have 385 hp and your competitor has 430hp I don't think that is significant as the S2k 240hp versus 350z 300 hp. 45hp is only 8.5% advantage over the 911 while 60hp is 25% advantage over the S2k. Anytime you don't like what the car has to offer easiest thing to do is don't buy it. Also, we all know that hp is only part of the performance sheet.

Fanman

The 350Z didn't originally come with 300 hp, it came out with 287 hp (so actually only about 16% greater, not 25%), and was several hundred lbs. heavier (2850 vs. 3250). So your comparison is off. The Porsche is also not 400 lbs. lighter than the Vette.

Actually having driven the cars I can tell you there are several things to love about the Porsche, and that are better than the Vette. But again, that's not the point. It's Porsche's insistence to stay with more & more outdated base platform. The comparison is the 345 hp base Carrera vs. the 430 hp Vette (that is a 20% hp differential & marginal weight difference). My point is why waste our time with the 3.6 L, and insist on charging extra for an "S" platform to get the readily available technology. That 3.8L should be on the base Carrera. They charge ridiculous sums for the "powerkits" as well. As most knowledgeable enthusiasts know the production cost differences between the engine platforms is virtually nil. That's the issue. Back in the day, it was Carrera vs. Vette, not Carrera S vs. Vette. It makes the value equation worse than ever. Straightline speed isn't everything, but it is something. The Carrera should be able to be competitive with the Vette (it's natural rival).

DesertRat

Please calm down the rhetoric or back it up with some stats. Where does the Z06 "ruin" a 997GT3? Maybe on the dragstrip a Z06 is marginally faster, but on any racetrack its a drivers race.

No one denies that Porsche products hp/$ ratio truly sucks, but as long as they continue being the world's most profitable car company I do not see them making any drastic changes to the formula. I would maintain that the hp/$ ratio for Porsche's products has been very bad also in the past.

If you want a Porsche properly faster than a Z06, buy the GT2.

ace123

another issue is that the dollar is failing, so the Z06 should be relatively better performance per dollar just because it's cheaper to spend more time and money on R&D/engineering work, especially when the car is also being sold in the US.

also, i think that after the last 10 years, "there's no replacement for displacement" is finally coming back. that's why we're still at 240hp--essentially peaked out on current NA technology. porsche has been running about the same displacement for a lot of years, and so has GM--that's why GM was able to simply open up the vettes to tap a lot more power. technology finally caught up, and american muscle is back.

PedalFaster

The difference in my mind is that I can feel and use the difference between 240 hp and 300 hp, but I have no idea how the difference between 385 hp and 430 hp would be useful to me on the street in any way other than bragging rights. Either is way too much power to use on the street.

I make no claim to this being Porsche's reasoning, but it's definitely a reason why the power delta wouldn't bother me if I were in the market for a new 911. I'd drive a 240 hp car differently than a 300 hp car, but I wouldn't drive a 385 hp car any differently from a 430 hp car, so why should I care about that paper difference?

For what it's worth -- I've been thinking seriously about trading in my 258 hp Boxster S for a 170 hp MX-5 for exactly the above reasons.

cbehney

Just want to point out the obvious - that Porsche isn't stupid, just tweaking their 911 design. Makes it a lot easier to put out $90K to $130K knowing your car won't look dated after a few years (except to something like 0.01% of the population ).

Dr. WOT

[QUOTE=Fanman,Jun 7 2008, 02:33 AM] The S2000 is underpowered for what it is today, especially with the 370Z/G37 being 330 hp, the upcoming 300+ hp Hyundai Genesis, Mustang going to 315+ hp, Boxster S going to 300 hp.

MDXLuvr

It cracks me up that S2000 owners who haven't seen any increase in HP in 8 years complain about the iconic 911.

The 2009 MY 911 C2S produces 8.5% more HP, has PDK, launch control(with sports chrono) and gives u 7.8% more MPG. I don't see how that can be bad. If you are looking for a revolutionary exterior styling that u might as well look somewhere else. The 911's exterior will always have minor exterior changes. Most 911 owners prefer it that way.

BTW, here is press release kit PDK file on all the upgrades(where I got the % data and launch control info).

http://www.drivers-republic.com/pdf/DR_911...e_Cabrio_GB.pdf

suzukawoods

how about the cayman? does it get dsg as well?

Chris S

I like Porsche's evolutionary styling, it helps keep older models looking good instead of dated.

For all the naysayers, you're not part of Porsche's target market - they're making serious money selling them, and many of their customers take the "There is no substitue" mantra pretty seriously.